Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 18, 2024, 09:58:23 AMI think the claims of DJ being a slow processor are more the result of fans claiming they see that on film (they don't) rather than a reflection of reality.  Unless you are at Greg Cosell level tape grinder (with access to the full 22), the average (and even above average fan) is not capable of discerning processing speed.   I would also suggest that if fans' claims about the slow processing were true, Schoen would have never signed DJ to the contract they did.

My biggest concern with DJ moving forward is that the Giants did such a horrible job protecting him over the years he is starting to see ghosts.   It's possible that DJ's ACL tear may prove to be a blessing in disguise because it gave him some time off from the beatings, and perhaps he will recover from his previous trauma.  That is a big question in my mind.  I'm not sure how DJ will react when he starts getting hit again.  So traumas become ingrained, and I don't care how tough you are; they just keep impacting you.

Much in the same vein as fans can't comment on processing speed. I don't think any fan can comprehensively say he's seeing ghosts. Has any staffer or player come out and said this?

If they have, I've missed it.

Jones gets all the excuses under the sun. In 7 days, we will know what the Giants think. He's either good enough for next year or he's not.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on April 18, 2024, 10:03:01 AMJones gets all the excuses under the sun.

With many fans, it's the complete opposite.  Those fans will never acknowledge the challenging situations Jones has had to deal with. Those fans expect Jones to perform literal miracles.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on April 18, 2024, 10:00:22 AMThe Giants already have a back-up. If they want to waste a spot on a 3rd QB - give it to DeVito.

There's no justification for wasting a 4th round pick on a QB that isn't contending to start.

The Giants need to get much better at identifying role players in rounds 3-5 rather than wasting them on "projects" ala Peart or 2nd/3rd string QBs.

Draft a QB early or not at all would be my preference.

I imagine the wisdom of drafting someone like Pratt depends on how the Giants view DeVito.  If the Giants don't view DeVito as becoming a high-level backup, then the 3rd QB spot is wide open, and when the season is over, they let Lock walk saving his $5 million salary cap hit (which could be higher if he meets performance incentives)

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 18, 2024, 10:05:34 AMWith many fans, it's the complete opposite.  Those fans will never acknowledge the challenging situations Jones has had to deal with. Those fans expect Jones to perform literal miracles.

And the converse is also true for his ardent supporters. They simply cannot admit that the re-signing was a mistake for a multitude of reasons - be it supporting cast not there, production or the fact he's injury prone.

Either way, he will have our answer on the franchise QB in 7 days or 12 months.

There's no need to go around in circles.

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 18, 2024, 09:58:23 AMI think the claims of DJ being a slow processor are more the result of fans claiming they see that on film (they don't) rather than a reflection of reality.  Unless you are at Greg Cosell level tape grinder (with access to the full 22), the average (and even above average fan) is not capable of discerning processing speed.   I would also suggest that if fans' claims about the slow processing were true, Schoen would have never signed DJ to the contract they did.

My biggest concern with DJ moving forward is that the Giants did such a horrible job protecting him over the years he is starting to see ghosts.   It's possible that DJ's ACL tear may prove to be a blessing in disguise because it gave him some time off from the beatings, and perhaps he will recover from his previous trauma.  That is a big question in my mind.  I'm not sure how DJ will react when he starts getting hit again.  So traumas become ingrained, and I don't care how tough you are; they just keep impacting you.

My take FWIW, is that the coaches analyze everything, and then DJ does what he's told to do based on the play called from the sideline. He isn't Roger Staubach calling plays in the huddle on his own while Landry watches to see what he decides to do. Giants coaches know DJ's limitations, and they also know the limitations of the OL and receivers. And they call the shots based on their own analysis and what they think will work. If DJ was a loose canon who did what he felt like doing instead of sticking to the play calling, he would have been cut a long time ago

I have no worries that DJ can't read the defense or that he processes slow. He's balancing doing what exactly what he's told, while usually running for his life...and don't forget, he has been told to NOT THROW INTERCEPTIONS after a bad start of turning the ball over

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on April 18, 2024, 10:34:55 AMMy take FWIW, is that the coaches analyze everything, and then DJ does what he's told to do based on the play called from the sideline. He isn't Roger Staubach calling plays in the huddle on his own while Landry watches to see what he decides to do. Giants coaches know DJ's limitations, and they also know the limitations of the OL and receivers. And they call the shots based on their own analysis and what they think will work. If DJ was a loose canon who did what he felt like doing instead of sticking to the play calling, he would have been cut a long time ago

I have no worries that DJ can't read the defense or that he processes slow. He's balancing doing what exactly what he's told, while usually running for his life...and don't forget, he has been told to NOT THROW INTERCEPTIONS after a bad start of turning the ball over

Ric,

The interception issue is an underappreciated one, in my opinion.   QBs are instructed by the coaching staff how much risk the coaches are willing to tolerate.  If a QB is told to be extra careful it will tend to slow down their progression and also reduce the depth of target

I think he processes fine.  I dont think he trusts his protection which he should not given how bad it was but that lack of trust is also making him unwilling to take shots down the field.  The latter is why I think the Giants need to move on from him.

Quote from: Philosophers on April 18, 2024, 10:53:16 AMI think he processes fine.  I dont think he trusts his protection which he should not given how bad it was but that lack of trust is also making him unwilling to take shots down the field.  The latter is why I think the Giants need to move on from him.

If the Giants don't draft a QB, it will be interesting to see if Jones (likely with the help of the team psychologist) is able to move past the trauma and learn to trust his protection.  If not, we may see Lock playing more this season.

Or that Lock outplays him either in pre-season or starts the season like a house on fire.

Granted it's unlikely for a journeyman to do so but it's not beyond the realm of possibility either.

Quote from: Jolly Blue Giant on April 18, 2024, 10:34:55 AMMy take FWIW, is that the coaches analyze everything, and then DJ does what he's told to do based on the play called from the sideline. He isn't Roger Staubach calling plays in the huddle on his own while Landry watches to see what he decides to do. Giants coaches know DJ's limitations, and they also know the limitations of the OL and receivers. And they call the shots based on their own analysis and what they think will work. If DJ was a loose canon who did what he felt like doing instead of sticking to the play calling, he would have been cut a long time ago

I have no worries that DJ can't read the defense or that he processes slow. He's balancing doing what exactly what he's told, while usually running for his life...and don't forget, he has been told to NOT THROW INTERCEPTIONS after a bad start of turning the ball over

These are the reasons I put him into the game manager category.

Plays will not always develop the way they are drawn up on the board. There's a lot of improvisation that happens on every play. The only improv DJ does is to cut and run.

I need my QB to understand the playbook but also know how to deviate from the called play and make sh*t happen.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on April 18, 2024, 10:15:57 AMAnd the converse is also true for his ardent supporters. They simply cannot admit that the re-signing was a mistake for a multitude of reasons - be it supporting cast not there, production or the fact he's injury prone.

Either way, he will have our answer on the franchise QB in 7 days or 12 months.

There's no need to go around in circles.

https://x.com/TalkinGiants/status/1780999156137361800


https://x.com/TheGiantsWire/status/1780997622553047304

Quote from: katkavage on April 18, 2024, 05:12:41 AMThat's a reason not to do it. Okay?

No.  But it's a reason to reign in faith that because the team does their due diligence and loves a guy he will end up being 'the guy'. 

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 18, 2024, 12:57:25 PMhttps://x.com/TalkinGiants/status/1780999156137361800


https://x.com/TheGiantsWire/status/1780997622553047304

There's a saying in England we use for politicians - don't believe anything until it's been officially denied.

Actions speak louder than words. In free agency we added a guy who can start a few if needed but is not the threat that eg Russell Wilson would be. In a week we will see if we draft a QB R1. If so, DJ is on the way out. If not, DJ is the projected starter even if we take a QB day 2 or 3. We will rehash the same old arguments on here come what may'

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on April 18, 2024, 01:23:27 PMThere's a saying in England we use for politicians - don't believe anything until it's been officially denied.

Furthermore, it's smoke and mirrors season. Why show your hand 7 days before the draft.

But people can swallow up whatever they want. Nothing will change opinions until either a) they draft a QB or b) make a decision next year.