Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on May 23, 2024, 07:32:42 PMI am rooting hard for Jones to recover well and to play well this year, because he is the QB of our team. And on a human level, knowing he's a good guy, I want to see him recover from him his injury and be well, if nothing else.

What I'm not going to do though is get swept up in these types of reports. And that includes what we read in late July and August, including preseason games. I heard all of this throughout last summer and bought into it a little bit, and then the guy and his offensive teammates were nothing short of an unmitigated disaster.

Needless to say I'd rather read reports from Giants beat writers that he "looks good" than that he "looks bad", but none of it really moves the needle for me. Also, these summer reports are generally always framed optimistically for all 32 teams. It's just the way this business works.

Most NFL players look good in May

Quote from: katkavage on May 24, 2024, 09:51:20 AMMost NFL players look good in May

With the exception of Drew Lock 

Quote from: MightyGiants on May 24, 2024, 09:57:17 AMWith the exception of Drew Lock 

I couldn't care less if Drew Lock went 0-20 on passes in May and DeVito went 20-20. All is meaningless until September.

Yup. I thought it was an unnecessary comment that added nothing to the discussion. Furthermore, those who are critical of Jones are often painted as fans like that.

Would some of you rather that Jones was throwing without accuracy or velocity?  He's doing very well in the context he's in, which is the most you can hope for.  There will be plenty of time to be critical if he doesn't sustain it as the context gets more challenging.  No need to get a head start on criticizing him by dismissing what he's doing.

Quote from: MightyGiants on May 24, 2024, 07:06:23 AMJeff,


This is a fair position.  No one is expected to be swept up due to an OTA performance.   This is just news on how our starting QB is recovering.   I think for most fans this report would be good news.   Although @BluesCruz booing the news, shows there are a handful of fans actively rooting against our starting QB.

I think it's good news that he seems to be recovering well from his injury and his surgery. As I said, on a purely human level that's always good news about any decent person, regardless of how he plays in real games.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on May 24, 2024, 01:46:10 PMWould some of you rather that Jones was throwing without accuracy or velocity?  He's doing very well in the context he's in, which is the most you can hope for.  There will be plenty of time to be critical if he doesn't sustain it as the context gets more challenging.  No need to get a head start on criticizing him by dismissing what he's doing.

Simply making the observation that stuff like this (1) is churned out by every beat writer of every team in the league this time of year and (2) has been proven time and again to have no consistent correlation to anything that happens when the games actually matter is not "getting a head start on criticizing" anyone. It's just making a factually accurate observation.

Further, I didn't tell anyone else how to process this and other info like it. I was simply stating my own stance towards it. I don't see why that needs to be attacked or falsely framed as "getting a head start on criticizing" players. That was not my intention at all.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on May 24, 2024, 01:57:00 PMSimply making the observation that stuff like this (1) is churned out by every beat writer of every team in the league this time of year and (2) has been proven time and again to have no consistent correlation to anything that happens when the games actually matter is not "getting a head start on criticizing" anyone. It's just making a factually accurate observation.

Further, I didn't tell anyone else how to process this and other info like it. I was simply stating my own stance towards it. I don't see why that needs to be attacked or falsely framed as "getting a head start on criticizing" players. That was not my intention at all.

You DO realize that other people were posting in the thread, and not every comment is addressed at/to you?  No need to get defensive.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on May 24, 2024, 02:04:05 PMYou DO realize that other people were posting in the thread, and not every comment is addressed at/to you?  No need to get defensive.

I think he was speaking rhetorically. And I also really didn't see anyone being critical but I do notice and like the fact that jones is defended by many no matter what. That isn't a bad thing.

Quote from: AZGiantFan on May 24, 2024, 02:04:05 PMYou DO realize that other people were posting in the thread, and not every comment is addressed at/to you?  No need to get defensive.

You know there's a quote function, right?

If you're not using it, I think it's rightly assumed you are addressing the Jones "haters".

As such, if you're addressing a wider group and using things like "would you be happy if he wasn't X, Y and Z". It appears you are rating everyone with the same brush as the silly BluesCruz comment - which the vast majority of the Jones critics refrain from.

Just food for thought; I'm not attacking you man and I enjoy your diametrically opposed views to mine and furthermore, I respect them. 

I don't understand the drew lock acquisition

Tommy has already proven he can carry the team if asked

Lock on the other hand has proved nothing in the NFL

Quote from: Trench on May 24, 2024, 02:25:42 PMI think he was speaking rhetorically. And I also really didn't see anyone being critical but I do notice and like the fact that jones is defended by many no matter what. That isn't a bad thing.

The solid majority of fans on this forum are very knowledgeable.   So I (and I assume @AZGiantFan  ) both see stating the obvious, that throwing well in OTAs does not guarantee success come September, as needless and it feels like it's said just so one can say something negative about the guy (it also feels a bit belittling as I certainly didn't need to be told about the meaning of OTAs).  Maybe I am wrong, and there was another reason it was said.   Maybe there has been just so much arguing and ill-feelings on this subject that there is over-sensitivity.

I've been an NFL and Giants fan since the 1960s. One thing I've learned is that the only thing that matters in pre season and these silly OTAs is not getting your players hurt..

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on May 24, 2024, 02:26:56 PMYou know there's a quote function, right?

If you're not using it, I think it's rightly assumed you are addressing the Jones "haters".

As such, if you're addressing a wider group and using things like "would you be happy if he wasn't X, Y and Z". It appears you are rating everyone with the same brush as the silly BluesCruz comment - which the vast majority of the Jones critics refrain from.

Just food for thought; I'm not attacking you man and I enjoy your diametrically opposed views to mine and furthermore, I respect them.

Yeah, I know there's a quote function but it's impractical to quote several people.  If I make a general comment and someone decides it applies to them and gets defensive then that's on them, not me.

And for the record, I don't think there are Jones "haters" I think there are Jones detractors.  It's not the same thing.  I think detractors tend to minimize and hand wave away the tremendous barriers to success he has faced here by calling them excuses.  I've never even taken a strong pro-Jones position.  I am agnostic on the issue of whether he can be the guy, long term.  But I am cognizant that time passing is not evidence that he can't be the guy when in none of that passage of time has he had a chance to to have the support of a functional OL and WR corp and, until recently, decent coaching.

And just to take it off DJ for a moment, I see something similar with the Neal detractors.  Between injuries, having to change sides, and terrible coaching there have been some serious barriers to his success.  But some people are unwilling to recognize this and simply express the frustration of impatience.  At least in my opinion.

But we're all Giants fans here and we all, including (especially?) me, can cut each other a little more slack.

Quote from: MightyGiants on May 24, 2024, 03:43:29 PMThe solid majority of fans on this forum are very knowledgeable.   So I (and I assume @AZGiantFan  ) both see stating the obvious, that throwing well in OTAs does not guarantee success come September, as needless and it feels like it's said just so one can say something negative about the guy (it also feels a bit belittling as I certainly didn't need to be told about the meaning of OTAs).  Maybe I am wrong, and there was another reason it was said.   Maybe there has been just so much arguing and ill-feelings on this subject that there is over-sensitivity.

Rich,
I'm not sure what you are getting at?