Big Blue Huddle

Interesting.

I couldn't find any name on this list that I strongly disagreed with, but a few that I think are at least worthy of discussion are:


Rodgers (Favre) I am comfortable saying Rodgers was probably the more talented of the two, but Favre was no slouch. I agree it should go to Rodgers though. More MVPs and more first team all pros. I don't think it's a runaway though.

Rivers (Fouts) Think this one is wide open for debate. Probably no less than a dead heat. Fouts was very, very good. He is a Hall of Famer. Is Rivers a guaranteed lock for the Hall? I think I might lean Fouts on this one.

Roethlisberger (Bradshaw) I think Ben was more talented but Bradshaw does have four rings and two Super Bowl MVPs. That is nothing to sneeze at. How many other QBs in NFL history can say that?

Jackson (Flacco) Are we absolutely positive we are ready to crown Jackson the greatest QB in Ravens history when his playoff resume so far is downright brutal? Flacco was 10-6 in postseason play, including multiple wins against the Brady/Belichick Pats in their prime, and he has a ring. Not to mention Flacco has exhibited longevity and impressive durability, which we don't know yet if Jackson will also do.

I understand Jackson may be viewed as having more talent and clearly being a far better athlete, but "best in team history" has a more all-encompassing meaning than that, at least to me. I think Josh Allen is more talented than Jim Kelly was, but I take no issue with 33rd Team stating that Kelly is the best Bills' QB ever. As of right now, I think that is a perfectly fair statement. I feel a bit the same way about Flacco and Jackson.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on July 20, 2024, 11:30:31 AMInteresting.

I couldn't find any name on this list that I strongly disagreed with, but a few that I think are at least worthy of discussion are:


Rodgers (Favre) I am comfortable saying Rodgers was probably the more talented of the two, but Favre was no slouch. I agree it should go to Rodgers though. More MVPs and more first team all pros. I don't think it's a runaway though.

Rivers (Fouts) Think this one is wide open for debate. Probably no less than a dead heat. Fouts was very, very good. He is a Hall of Famer. Is Rivers a guaranteed lock for the Hall? I think I might lean Fouts on this one.

Roethlisberger (Bradshaw) I think Ben was more talented but Bradshaw does have four rings and two Super Bowl MVPs. That is nothing to sneeze at. How many other QBs in NFL history can say that?

Jackson (Flacco) Are we absolutely positive we are ready to crown Jackson the greatest QB in Ravens history when his playoff resume so far is downright brutal? Flacco was 10-6 in postseason play, including multiple wins against the Brady/Belichick Pats in their prime, and he has a ring. Not to mention Flacco has exhibited longevity and impressive durability, which we don't know yet if Jackson will also do.

I understand Jackson may be viewed as having more talent and clearly being a far better athlete, but "best in team history" has a more all-encompassing meaning than that, at least to me. I think Josh Allen is more talented than Jim Kelly was, but I take no issue with 33rd Team stating that Kelly is the best Bills' QB ever. As of right now, I think that is a perfectly fair statement. I feel a bit the same way about Flacco and Jackson.

I agree. A case  could be made for those players.   I do feel, you really couldn't make aa mistake going with either player.

Id rate Phil Simms over Eli.....that other-worldly performance in Pasadena sealed it for me.  Maybe Simms had better players on both sides of the ball

I dont know....nothing against Eli. He was great

If I had to win one game though, I'd take Tarkenton

All 3 of them are HOF players.  When will we get our next HOF QB?

Quote from: BluesCruz on July 21, 2024, 09:54:30 AMAll 3 of them are HOF players. 

Not sure what you meant exactly by the above, but Simms is not in the HOF.

Perhaps you meant you think he should be in the HOF, but that is at best debatable. I would surmise that the vast majority of non-Giants fans do not think he should be.

Eli is not in the HOF yet either for that matter. I think it is highly likely, if not close to certain, that he will be, but we do not know that for sure yet. Your quoted statement above sounds matter of fact.

Tarkenton should not be in this conversation from my point of view. He was only on the Giants for five seasons, plus they already have him down for Minnesota, which I think is the best place for him.

As someone wrote.  Flaco was Mr playoffs
We understand Lamar has more talent but a better QB
Especially in the playoffs
That is a stretch
Even though I think staubach  is the correct choice
I bet some cowboys fans would put in Aikman

Flacco over Lamar Jackson
Fouts over Rivers.

Arguments could be made for Aikman and Bradshaw.

Joe Burrow could enter the conversation if he can stay healthy.

While I appreciate the arguments for Flacco, I have a hard time looking at these honors for Jackson

2× NFL Most Valuable Player (2019, 2023)
2× First-team All-Pro (2019, 2023)
3× Pro Bowl (2019, 2021, 2023)
NFL passing touchdowns leader (2019)
2× Bert Bell Award (2019, 2023)


Compare to Flacco

Super Bowl champion (XLVII)
Super Bowl MVP (XLVII)
NFL Comeback Player of the Year (2023)


As for Fouts, that is an interesting matchup

NFL Offensive Player of the Year (1982)
2× First-team All-Pro (1979, 1982)
2× Second-team All-Pro (1980, 1985)
6× Pro Bowl (1979–1983, 1985)
4× NFL passing yards leader (1979–1982)
2× NFL passing touchdowns leader (1981, 1982)
NFL completion percentage leader (1979)
NFL 1980s All-Decade Team
San Diego Chargers 50th Anniversary Team
Los Angeles Chargers Hall of Fame
Los Angeles Chargers No. 14 retired

Versus Rivers


NFL Comeback Player of the Year (2013)
8× Pro Bowl (2006, 2009–2011, 2013, 2016–2018)
NFL passing yards leader (2010)
NFL passing touchdowns co-leader (2008)
NFL passer rating leader (2008)
NFL completion percentage leader (2013)
San Diego Chargers 50th Anniversary Team

Good discussion!

For the Rams, I suppose you can't go wrong with Kurt Warner's Cinderella NFL story. Still, the legendary QBs Bob Waterfield and "The Dutchman," Norm Van Brocklin, might have something to say about it. Van Brocklin still holds the NFL record for most passing yards in a single game.

I will give the 33rd Team folks great credit for giving best Cowboys' QB to Roger Staubach. Despite being a hated rival, nobody hates on Roger and he was the best of them all.

I also believe you give Bradshaw in Pittsburgh the nod. You can see the bias with my age, I know, but you go 4-0 in the Big Dance, get awarded the MVP twice, there's nobody in front of you, sir! Put Terry's mug on there!

For the Colts, do you like Peyton Manning or Johnny Unitas? Hmmm. That's a pick'em to me!

Peace!

The Peyton/Unitus clash is a great one. There is no doubt Peyton was the better passer, by a long margin but Unitas as as good an all round QB as there ever was. He called all his own plays, was about as smart as they come.
I vote Unitas but only by the slimmest margins.

Quote from: MightyGiants on July 21, 2024, 03:23:15 PMWhile I appreciate the arguments for Flacco, I have a hard time looking at these honors for Jackson

2× NFL Most Valuable Player (2019, 2023)
2× First-team All-Pro (2019, 2023)
3× Pro Bowl (2019, 2021, 2023)
NFL passing touchdowns leader (2019)
2× Bert Bell Award (2019, 2023)


Compare to Flacco

Super Bowl champion (XLVII)
Super Bowl MVP (XLVII)
NFL Comeback Player of the Year (2023)


As for Fouts, that is an interesting matchup

NFL Offensive Player of the Year (1982)
2× First-team All-Pro (1979, 1982)
2× Second-team All-Pro (1980, 1985)
6× Pro Bowl (1979–1983, 1985)
4× NFL passing yards leader (1979–1982)
2× NFL passing touchdowns leader (1981, 1982)
NFL completion percentage leader (1979)
NFL 1980s All-Decade Team
San Diego Chargers 50th Anniversary Team
Los Angeles Chargers Hall of Fame
Los Angeles Chargers No. 14 retired

Versus Rivers


NFL Comeback Player of the Year (2013)
8× Pro Bowl (2006, 2009–2011, 2013, 2016–2018)
NFL passing yards leader (2010)
NFL passing touchdowns co-leader (2008)
NFL passer rating leader (2008)
NFL completion percentage leader (2013)
San Diego Chargers 50th Anniversary Team

I hear you on Flacco/Lamar. I am certainly not suggesting Lamar is not the significantly more talented player. But if I'm evaluating a QB's career in its totality I do consider their postseason resume important. Lamar's may end up being as good as or better than Flacco's. But we're not there yet, and in fact Lamar's has been bad so far despite consistently playing on very good teams with great coaches. Meanwhile Flacco has 10 playoff wins and a ring. I think that disparity makes a discussion on them viable. In other words I don't personally consider Lamar a runaway for this yet. Will he be in time? Likely, yes.

Fouts over Rivers
Flacco over Lamar Jackson
Bradshaw over Ben maybe?
Joe Montana over Mahomes ?

THat last SB seriously has me wondering if I can bring myself to watch football any more. Most boring SB I have ever watched in my life, and it is not really close. Lost a lot of respect for Mahomes and what the game has become.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on July 21, 2024, 06:42:50 PMI hear you on Flacco/Lamar. I am certainly not suggesting Lamar is not the significantly more talented player. But if I'm evaluating a QB's career in its totality I do consider their postseason resume important. Lamar's may end up being as good as or better than Flacco's. But we're not there yet, and in fact Lamar's has been bad so far despite consistently playing on very good teams with great coaches. Meanwhile Flacco has 10 playoff wins and a ring. I think that disparity makes a discussion on them viable. In other words I don't personally consider Lamar a runaway for this yet. Will he be in time? Likely, yes.

Which QB, Flacco or Lamar, do you think played on the more talented teams?

If you are talking "ever" then the Ravens history includes the Brown's history up until the new Brown's franchise. So that would make Otto Graham the greatest Browns/Ravens QB. San Diego, Rivers or Hadl. Colts, Peyton or Johnny U. Buffalo, Kelly or Kemp. Philly should be Van Brocklin, he never puked under center.

Quote from: MightyGiants on July 22, 2024, 08:52:08 AMWhich QB, Flacco or Lamar, do you think played on the more talented teams?

So is the implication that Flaco played on more talented teams ? I really have not followed the Ravens closely enough, but even mediocre QB play from Flacco in the playoffs and regular season should better L Jax's great regular season play and horrible post season play.

WHy not ask the same questions of Eli Manning. Like who played on better coached teams Eli or Mahomes or Joe Montana or Brady for matter?