Big Blue Huddle

Despite Schoen using a high 1, a second a third and a fifth round pick on linemen, not a single one of them are currently starting.   Admittedly injuries are involved to a degree, but even then, none have shown they are NFL starter caliber.

Quote from: MightyGiants on August 05, 2024, 07:44:09 AMDespite Schoen using a high 1, a second a third and a fifth round pick on linemen, not a single one of them are currently starting.   Admittedly injuries are involved to a degree, but even then, none have shown they are NFL starter caliber.

Rich: Yes, this was a point I stressed last week, when saying that despite all the money the Giants spend on their scouting department, they are not only bad at drafting OL's, they're also not very good at developing them (the latter point, of course, has nothing to do with the scouting department). In short, they stink. Bob

Quote from: Bob In PA on August 05, 2024, 07:53:27 AMRich: Yes, this was a point I stressed last week, when saying that despite all the money the Giants spend on their scouting department, they are not only bad at drafting OL's, they're also not very good at developing them (the latter point, of course, has nothing to do with the scouting department). In short, they stink. Bob

I am always mindful the O-line coach is heavily involved in the scouting of the offensive line.   It's possible the fault lay with Bobby Johnson, who also developed them.  Of course, injuries was also an issue, but I will not rehash my views on that topic.

Quote from: MightyGiants on August 05, 2024, 08:06:03 AMI am always mindful the O-line coach is heavily involved in the scouting of the offensive line.   It's possible the fault lay with Bobby Johnson, who also developed them.  Of course, injuries was also an issue, but I will not rehash my views on that topic.

Rich: I think at some point or other at least once last week, both of us used the phrase "beggars can't be choosers" in referring to the offensive line.  Once you get "behind the 8-ball" with that group, it's tough to catch up.  They needed to hit on at least one OL pick in the Schoen era, and the fact that they didn't meant that they had to focus on OL in free-agency. Luckily, they had a bit more money available this year (compared to last) but the pickings were IMO still fairly slim. I know Jones is a huge factor but the OL situation over all is why the experts mostly believe we won't win more than four, five or six games. Bob

I do appreciate that he seems to have acknowledged that drafting OL may not be his strength and instead went out and signed 3 Free Agent OL.  Knowing that was the biggest weakness and finding guys that have at least had success in the NFL already 2 of which having had that success with their current OL coach. 

I've said it before but taking Neal to me is not a bad job by Schoen in the sense that every team had Neal ranked 1 or 1A when it came to tackles that year and they needed a tackle.  He'd have busted for whatever team ended up taking him but he wasn't getting out of the top 10 no matter what the Giants did.  Busts happen to every GM.  But this isn't Gettleman going rogue and taking Jones at 6 or trading up for Baker.

Just absolutely dismal and the primary reason we are in the rut we are in.  If we don't get some OL to work together and gel this year, it will be the same old song and dance.

Bobby Johnson was terrible, there have been injuries to all 3, and one was a day 3 pick so I can't fault that one.

Ezeudu at least is a versatile and decent (as a backup/reserve) whether or not there potential for more with good coaching i dont know.

Neal is a wash most likely, not sure if he can even get on the field, you cant coach health. Bricillo could maybe have him doing better, but who knows.

McKethan is probably PS bound this year

Quote from: MrGap92 on August 05, 2024, 11:00:32 AMBobby Johnson was terrible, there have been injuries to all 3, and one was a day 3 pick so I can't fault that one.

Ezeudu at least is a versatile and decent (as a backup/reserve) whether or not there potential for more with good coaching i dont know.

Neal is a wash most likely, not sure if he can even get on the field, you cant coach health. Bricillo could maybe have him doing better, but who knows.

McKethan is probably PS bound this year

Versatile yes, decent no. Ezeudu was horrible when pressed into service.  If he makes the team, it will tell me we haven't improved the depth much at all.  If he has to play much, we're in trouble.

Quote from: Gman329 on August 05, 2024, 11:47:05 AMEzeudu If he makes the team, it will tell me we haven't improved the depth much at all. 

329: I like that line of thought but think McKethan's the one to watch not Ezeudu. IMO the Giants don't have a swing-tackle on the roster (who is not injured)... they need one in case (heaven help us) Andrew Thomas goes down. Ezeudu can do the job (although I agree 100%... not very well). Unless they sign a vet swing-tackle before the season starts Ezeudu is highly likely to make the team by default, IMO. Bob

Interestingly, just like Flowers, Neal refused to participate in the linemen agility drills at the Combine. Perhaps the scouting department should view that as a huge red flag for future picks?


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Quote from: Bob In PA on August 05, 2024, 09:23:45 AMRich: I think at some point or other at least once last week, both of us used the phrase "beggars can't be choosers" in referring to the offensive line.  Once you get "behind the 8-ball" with that group, it's tough to catch up.  They needed to hit on at least one OL pick in the Schoen era, and the fact that they didn't meant that they had to focus on OL in free-agency. Luckily, they had a bit more money available this year (compared to last) but the pickings were IMO still fairly slim. I know Jones is a huge factor but the OL situation over all is why the experts mostly believe we won't win more than four, five or six games. Bob

Had the Giants hit on a few of their O-line picks, they could have kept Barkley

Quote from: todge on August 05, 2024, 01:26:44 PMInterestingly, just like Flowers, Neal refused to participate in the linemen agility drills at the Combine. Perhaps the scouting department should view that as a huge red flag for future picks?


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If there was a prize for the best agent, Neal's agent should win it.  They posted a video of Neal jumping up on some boxes, and that led every team to believe Neal was this freak athlete, a big man when in reality, he is a below-average athlete with poor balance.

No doubt Neal would have tanked the Combine had he participated.

The Giants spent a ton of time doing due diligence on Thibodeaux. Thibodeaux had a lot of shade on him about "worrying about his brand" and what not, and I recall the Giants indicating that they had really spent time digging deep into Thibodeaux's profile to make sure he'd be a culture fit.

I can't help but wonder if all that time they devoted to analyzing Thibodeaux cut into the time they were able to spend studying Neal more closely, and they just assumed he was a lock to be good, based on the consensus view that he was a plug and play stud.

I'm not suggesting they didn't significantly scout him, but it seemed like they spent more in depth time and work on Thibodeaux that year.

Quote from: todge on August 05, 2024, 01:26:44 PMInterestingly, just like Flowers, Neal refused to participate in the linemen agility drills at the Combine. Perhaps the scouting department should view that as a huge red flag for future picks?


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Yeah, I think in the future, any lineman that refuses agility drills should just be taken off the board.

Neal would've been a 5th round pick if he had done those drills.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on August 05, 2024, 10:52:18 PMThe Giants spent a ton of time doing due diligence on Thibodeaux. Thibodeaux had a lot of shade on him about "worrying about his brand" and what not, and I recall the Giants indicating that they had really spent time digging deep into Thibodeaux's profile to make sure he'd be a culture fit.

I can't help but wonder if all that time they devoted to analyzing Thibodeaux cut into the time they were able to spend studying Neal more closely, and they just assumed he was a lock to be good, based on the consensus view that he was a plug and play stud.

I'm not suggesting they didn't significantly scout him, but it seemed like they spent more in depth time and work on Thibodeaux that year.

If you recall, Schoen was fine with drafting Ekwonu or Neal; he considered them somewhat interchangeable.  For what it's worth, Ekwonu hasn't really played well, either.