Big Blue Huddle

We have 10 days off to try and fix some of the things we all see as being wrong with this team.

So HYPERTHETHICALLY, if you were the HC of the Giants tomorrow, what one thing would you do in the next game (or future) on offense and defense to try and change our fortunes for the rest of the year?

If I were the HC, the first thing I would do on defense is to make Simmons an every-down defensive player and have him rush the QB as much as I could. I have always been a fan of Simmons, and no one has found a way to use him correctly. IMHO he can be a force rushing the passer and that is the one thing I would do immediately on defense.

On offense, I would see what we have with our 2 other QBs and if we have any interest in keeping any of them for next year. We know what we have with Jones, decent numbers, but can't throw deep anymore, and just not a winner. I would start Lock for our next game and then, see if DeVito can be a viable backup. In this same line, I  will have my QB spread the field more, and call more downfield throws since our OL seems to be able to hold off the defenders giving our QB a chance to throw deep. Use Hyatt, even for someone to spread the field.

So what would you do on offense and defense to help this team improve?

I don't think Schoen and Daboll have the balls to pull Jones. The main reason is they don't have a QB who will play better. The narrative is that Jones played well but Daboll has to know better. I agree with you. I would start Lock and see how he does at least one game but because of the stat sheet, I can't see them doing that until after they would lose at Seattle. 1-4 coming home against the Bengals would be a bad scene if Jones doesn't play up to the task.

The other consideration is to ride the Jones wagon and get the best draft pick that you wind up with. Would that result in Daboll getting canned?

Daboll made a lot of mistakes
Some that were so bad there is no explanation
But we see this team is getting better
D Jones isnt it
So,  maybe give him a chance to have a better QB

I said it during the draft and I maintain the position: I still think Drew Lock is a better QB than Jones.

Lock looked terrible in camp

Lenn,
This is a good discussion with 10 days off and one which may see us all change our mind as the days pass.

For me...

Offense:
Throw the ball early and offer to our TE position. It will open up the run and open up Nabers. There is NO excuse for this as we saw Bellinger catch and run in his rookie year - now he can't do it 2 years later?...and Theo if he were on KC would be lighting it up and that's a fact!

Defense:
Try Chatman alongside Big Dex and see what the combo can do

Daboll has really screwed us up by not trying to use the TE. Every defense knows when we are running (screen has helped disguise) but the head coach play caller stopped calling the one play that works!

Use the TE like everyone else does. Try.

Quote from: Ed Vette on September 28, 2024, 09:29:03 PMI don't think Schoen and Daboll have the balls to pull Jones. The main reason is they don't have a QB who will play better. The narrative is that Jones played well but Daboll has to know better. I agree with you. I would start Lock and see how he does at least one game but because of the stat sheet, I can't see them doing that until after they would lose at Seattle. 1-4 coming home against the Bengals would be a bad scene if Jones doesn't play up to the task.

The other consideration is to ride the Jones wagon and get the best draft pick that you wind up with. Would that result in Daboll getting canned?

Hard to say.

I think if the Giants ended up with something like a 5-12 record (or worse), it would be hard for Mara to bring Daboll back. I think he would probably give Schoen another shot, just because GMs tend to get more time than head coaches and maybe Mara believes Schoen deserves one more crack at fixing the team with "his guy."

I think if Mara was extremely protective of Jones and pushed Schoen hard to sign him after the 2022 season, he might be willing to privately acknowledge that and bring everyone back with a new QB that is entirely their pick. Remember, these guys didn't want to give Jones the fifth year option, so it's not obvious they were huge believers in him from the beginning.

I could see a scenario where after the 2022 season Schoen privately told Mara he wanted to tag Jones and move on from Barkley (or at least to not overpay for him). I could see Mara having vetoed that plan. if that was the case, then it's a bit harsh to fire these guys after Jones turned out to be a disaster post the contract Mara insisted on them giving out. I'm not saying this definitely happened, mind you. Just that if it did, or something along these lines did, firing these guys would be a bit extreme if not unfair.

Also let's not forget that they've only had two bad seasons (assuming 2024 ends badly). In 2022 they took a team that was a disaster the year before and let it to a playoff win, with the coach getting coach of the year. So if he first anyone after this year, that's based on just two bad seasons.

My gut is that Mara would prefer not to, but if this season goes badly enough he might have to fire the coach. I tend to think Schoen gets at least another year no matter what. Daboll's fate is less certain in my mind.

Quote from: Trench on September 28, 2024, 10:34:46 PMLenn,
This is a good discussion with 10 days off and one which may see us all change our mind as the days pass.

For me...

Offense:
Throw the ball early and offer to our TE position. It will open up the run and open up Nabers. There is NO excuse for this as we saw Bellinger catch and run in his rookie year - now he can't do it 2 years later?...and Theo if he were on KC would be lighting it up and that's a fact!

Defense:
Try Chatman alongside Big Dex and see what the combo can do

Daboll has really screwed us up by not trying to use the TE. Every defense knows when we are running (screen has helped disguise) but the head coach play caller stopped calling the one play that works!

Use the TE like everyone else does. Try.

I agree about the TE. Just would like a different QB to be doing it.

I'd spend some time on my resume'.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on September 29, 2024, 06:28:00 AMHard to say.

I think if the Giants ended up with something like a 5-12 record (or worse), it would be hard for Mara to bring Daboll back. I think he would probably give Schoen another shot, just because GMs tend to get more time than head coaches and maybe Mara believes Schoen deserves one more crack at fixing the team with "his guy."

I think if Mara was extremely protective of Jones and pushed Schoen hard to sign him after the 2022 season, he might be willing to privately acknowledge that and bring everyone back with a new QB that is entirely their pick. Remember, these guys didn't want to give Jones the fifth year option, so it's not obvious they were huge believers in him from the beginning.

I could see a scenario where after the 2022 season Schoen privately told Mara he wanted to tag Jones and move on from Barkley (or at least to not overpay for him). I could see Mara having vetoed that plan. if that was the case, then it's a bit harsh to fire these guys after Jones turned out to be a disaster post the contract Mara insisted on them giving out. I'm not saying this definitely happened, mind you. Just that if it did, or something along these lines did, firing these guys would be a bit extreme if not unfair.

Also let's not forget that they've only had two bad seasons (assuming 2024 ends badly). In 2022 they took a team that was a disaster the year before and let it to a playoff win, with the coach getting coach of the year. So if he first anyone after this year, that's based on just two bad seasons.

My gut is that Mara would prefer not to, but if this season goes badly enough he might have to fire the coach. I tend to think Schoen gets at least another year no matter what. Daboll's fate is less certain in my mind.

It seemed pretty clear when they didn't grant Jones the 5th year that they had every intention of moving on from him as quickly as possible and only a miracle playoff appearance aided by some decent scheduling and some all time good luck threw a monkey wrench into that plan.  Clearly they should have stuck to their guns but I understand why the pivot.

Having said that i don't think mara fires either one until he gives them a chance to win with a QB they choose.  Whether via the draft or a retread like Baker was in Tampa.  It would only be fair.  And in Daboll's defense, I think he's getting the absolute best version of Daniel Jones there is.  It's just this is the best version of Daniel Jones.  We know what his worst looks like, we've seen plenty of that over the years. 

To answer the original question...the one thing I'm doing is taking precautions to try and mitigate the risk of Jones getting hurt.  Nothing can fully eliminate it but I'm not calling a lot of QB runs for him I'm not calling many deep balls to risk the OL breaking down and getting him crushed. (Doesn't seem like he can hit on those anyway)  Get the ball throw the ball move on and if they lose they lose. 

I can never root for them to lose on Gameday but from here on out the best case scenario is for them to play a game like Thursday night.  Be competitive, put a scare into the opponent, look competent on both sides of the ball, and then blow it at the end.  Moving them into position to draft Jones' successor.  If not for a meaning less 3 game win streak they might very well have Jayden Daniels on this team right now.  Let's not make the same mistake twice.

Well, they're 1-3, have been competitive in three of the four games they've played (NOTE: the Vikings are 4-0 for now so you can almost give them a pass for that one) and their balanced scorecard thus far isn't a disgrace, by any means, but it does call for areas of improvement.

Having a tight end run the seam pattern would be a dream for this team. But can Danny Dimes execute it even a fraction as well as the master, Phil Simms, did in his heyday to Mark Bavaro, Zeke Mowatt and Howard Cross? The answer is I have no idea. Eli Manning could as well, but this head coach doesn't appear to have that play in his book.

The team has an issue with stopping the run when Dex is spelled for a few plays. That has to get figured out and quickly, in my opinion. Would bringing a Simmons up into the box help the cause?

Another season, another kicker fiasco, another loss on the books because of it. Unfortunately, it is probably time to move on from Gano, as much as I like him and hoped he would kick for the Giants into his 40s and beyond. But Joseph rebounded well last week; however, I'm not sure he's the guy when the winds start whipping up in the Sardine Can. The Irish lad knows how to kick in all kinds of inclement weather, has played soccer, Gaelic football, Aussie Rules and understands how to kick in windy conditions. He still may get his opportunity before this is all said and done but the Giants may be going after a new kicker next year.

The QB situation is going to play out the way it is until either Jones gets injured or completely implodes. He isn't what fans here want in a QB but he's the man, at least for now, and hasn't done anything worthy of getting yanked. But I do agree that Daboll should try to throw a little more creativity in the playbook if only to keep opposing defenses honest.

For a team with limitations in talent as the Giants are, and this is generally accepted as factual, they are playing roughly at their level, like it or not. Could they do some things better? Of course! Have they done some things to surprise us fans? Yes, a few things. Nothing earth shattering but the new kids they've picked up have been exciting to watch.

Am I canning the coach yet? No, not yet. I want this season to play out in full and how these players, and their coach, respond before making such a decision. The team is generally healthy, save for a couple of players, and I want to see everyone perform in his system over a full season and, in particular, see if they are all-in come the final week.

Peace!

I would bring in members of the 86' and 00' defense and have them talk to this defense about the "will to destroy an offense" by hitting really hard and often. Players in today's game don't want to get hit, and the rules support that. So now is the perfect time to do the opposite and lay the wood. I don't care if it rains yellow as long as opposing receivers develop "alligator" arms when crossing the field.

I would also find a defensive backfield coach somewhere out there in coach land who can teach a DB how to turn and look for the ball, and not look like toddlers chasing a cat. It's one thing if a DB gets clearly beat, but if they are in close proximity turn and look for the damn ball. This is at the college and pro level, probably HS too. There would be less PI's and more picks too.

Shake up the Offense.
I would use what I got and have some fun.
We WILL run a crazy trick play just to get these guys to stop taking themselves so seriously.
I'd take advantage of of Chatman's insane athleticism and line him up at fullback a few times. Then throw him a pass.
I'd take the reigns off Jones and call more design runs for the QB.
I'd tell Tracy he's the #1 back but he isn't going to start until he earns it. Until then I'd line up Singletary in the backfield and WanDale at WR. The next play but Singletary at WR and Wandale in the backfield.
I'd remind Gray and Singletary that they have both fumbled twice and they each owe me a touchdown.
I'd ask Ford Wheaton if he wants to play Special Teams for the rest of his life or does he want to play Offense. I need someone to be big in the middle of the field. Are you that guy?
I'd tell Nabors he is playing well but is still only the 3rd best WR from LSU in the NFL. How good do you want to be?

I'd keep everyone guessing and everything fresh, starting with my own team.

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