Big Blue Huddle

I'm often not a fan of Tiki, but in this case I feel he is spot on here. Jones is not bad, he just does not have that "it" factor, and is incapable of stepping up in big or important moments. I'm just unsure that is something you can learn or develop. He has a great work ethic, good guy, good character, works hard. It just does not translate to on field success which is a shame. You can't not love the guy as a person.

I watched the video on youtube when he discussed this, and he made a great point, using Eli as an example, where even while he didn't always have the best statistical seasons, or crazy good W/L records, he stepped up on the big stages, and was great when he needed to be.

https://www.si.com/nfl/giants/tiki-barber-explains-why-daniel-jones-is-not-that-guy-for-giants-01j8v44s1jtg

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/new-york-giants/dave-tollefson-tiki-barber-daniel-jones/

Here is the video, I thought was a good listen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4lwDVcBCJI

Than who is "the guy"?


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Quote from: todge on October 03, 2024, 12:43:50 PMThan who is "the guy"?


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Not on the roster, Daboll and Schoen need to figure that out.

Quote from: MrGap92 on October 03, 2024, 12:32:29 PMI'm often not a fan of Tiki, but in this case I feel he is spot on here. Jones is not bad, he just does not have that "it" factor, and is incapable of stepping up in big or important moments. I'm just unsure that is something you can learn or develop. He has a great work ethic, good guy, good character, works hard. It just does not translate to on field success which is a shame. You can't not love the guy as a person.

I watched the video on youtube when he discussed this, and he made a great point, using Eli as an example, where even while he didn't always have the best statistical seasons, or crazy good W/L records, he stepped up on the big stages, and was great when he needed to be.

https://www.si.com/nfl/giants/tiki-barber-explains-why-daniel-jones-is-not-that-guy-for-giants-01j8v44s1jtg

https://heavy.com/sports/nfl/new-york-giants/dave-tollefson-tiki-barber-daniel-jones/

Here is the video, I thought was a good listen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4lwDVcBCJI

On point with exactly all the arguments many fans on here have submitted.

Quote from: todge on October 03, 2024, 12:43:50 PMThan who is "the guy"?


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Hopefully the kid from Alabama, Deion kid, or Arch. If we lose this week we should seriously consider trading players and stockpiling picks to be able to move up and get one of these guys

Quote from: Trench on October 03, 2024, 12:50:49 PMHopefully the kid from Alabama, Deion kid, or Arch. If we lose this week we should seriously consider trading players and stockpiling picks to be able to move up and get one of these guys

I'm a Cam Ward fan myself. I wouldn't be against Milroe or Sanders though. Sanders would be my #2 in this drafts

Arch isn't eligible until 2026, curious to see how he does and develops in college. Still a bit early for him but I hope the best for him.

Yes, what Tiki said about the "it factor." I could not agree more.

Peace!

beware....with Deion's kid, comes Deion. Talk about unwanted distractions....No Thanks

What is it with this obsession with nepotism? Deion's kid, Eli's nephew. Hell Arch isn't even a starter! If his last name wasn't Manning no one would even mention his name. No team will just strategize and purposely suck for 2 straight seasons to draft someone. It's crazy talk.

Quote from: TDToomer on October 03, 2024, 02:52:51 PMWhat is it with this obsession with nepotism? Deion's kid, Eli's nephew. Hell Arch isn't even a starter! If his last name wasn't Manning no one would even mention his name. No team will just strategize and purposely suck for 2 straight seasons to draft someone. It's crazy talk.

Who mentioned anything about tanking? It would be crazy talk if it was actually suggested.

Fact is, Sanders is one of the top prospects this year, so it is only natural for him to be discussed. It is perfectly acceptable if you do not like him as a prospect. I don't think anyone like him because of his blood or last name.

Arch will probably start next year, and has played in the last few games in place of Ewers. I personally am not a fan of talking the 2026 draft already, but for the time being, his name is in that mix I suppose, probably to some extent for being a Manning. I think he has a ways to go myself.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/player/gamelog/_/id/4870906/arch-manning

Quote from: MrGap92 on October 03, 2024, 03:01:11 PMWho mentioned anything about tanking? It would be crazy talk if it was actually suggested.

Fact is, Sanders is one of the top prospects this year, so it is only natural for him to be discussed. It is perfectly acceptable if you do not like him as a prospect. I don't think anyone like him because of his blood or last name.

Arch will probably start next year, and has played in the last few games in place of Ewers. I personally am not a fan of talking the 2026 draft already, but for the time being, his name is in that mix I suppose, probably to some extent for being a Manning. I think he has a ways to go myself.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/player/gamelog/_/id/4870906/arch-manning

If one is discussing the possibilities of drafting a QB early in 2026 then yes that is suggesting to just continue to suck throughout 2025 which in effect is textbook tanking.

I'm sure kid Sanders is a good QB prospect but seeing his name grouped together with a Manning and one has to wonder what is the connection besides their famous family names? Pedigree shouldn't influence anyone's decision. The stuff I read on IG or FB is crazy talk.

TBH I would steer far away from a child of Deion Sanders. This fanbase hate showboats and his father was one of least classist players I have ever seen in the NFL. Deion was also so obsessed with money (remember his rap video and Pizza Hut commercials with Jerrah?) that he drew a dollar sign in the batters box with his bat after he was called up to the Yankees. No one does that in baseball. So I would assume he would whine about money his entire time with the Giants.

So I guess Tiki is telling us that he is smarter than JS and Dabs.

He may be for all I know

I wonder if Tiki gave that advice to JS and Dabs before those two staked their very jobs on re-signing DJ??

Isnt it nice that he can sit there and spout off his opinion and we are all supposed to embrace it because he is after all TIKI!!!!

I could question some of the decisions he has made in his life but I dont know enough about those decisions to do so.

In the meantime  we have a QB situation that IMHO deserves our support as fans--we can question the validity of the decision JS and Dabs made  but I just cant watch DJ take the field for the team that I am so heavily attached to knowing that he doesn't have the "it" factor or that he cant get us in the endzone

If Dj is not our QB next year I will root for whoever is just as I root for DJ.  Just as I did for example, Kerry Collins, Joe Pisarcik, Tarkenton, et al



Dumpster Dan

Dumpster Dan

I didnt read or watch the video

What is Tiki using as his criteria for saying that DJ doesnt have the "it" factor

Is he talking about game winning drives for example?  That would be subject to how the game has gone up till that point>

Maybe some QB's are not put in the position of needing to show the "it" factor as it relates to a game winning drive

I know that I am probably all wet  but is Tiki suggesting that when a player takes the field  he automatically takes over and carries the entire team with him?  I would suggest that there is one QB in todays NFL who does that --Mahomes

Keep in mind  JS and Dabs based their decision to retain DJ based largely on the season DJ had in 2022

For reference  he had 6 game winning drives--and if memory serves he had a game winning drive in the playoff win over the Vikes.

Lets be honest--how many of us felt pretty good about our QB situation after the 2022 season??

As I said  I may very well be misinterpreting Tiki's reasoning--but I am also old and wise enough to know that for every Tiki out there there is someone with the opposite view--hell, look no further than the BBH

Dumpster Dan

I agree with him. Thing is, does Tiki really believe it himself or is he just echoing what he thinks fans want to hear? Back in the offseason he was lecturing us about how we shouldn't draft a quarterback. 

Quote from: TDToomer on October 03, 2024, 03:53:11 PMIf one is discussing the possibilities of drafting a QB early in 2026 then yes that is suggesting to just continue to suck throughout 2025 which in effect is textbook tanking.

I'm sure kid Sanders is a good QB prospect but seeing his name grouped together with a Manning and one has to wonder what is the connection besides their famous family names? Pedigree shouldn't influence anyone's decision. The stuff I read on IG or FB is crazy talk.

TBH I would steer far away from a child of Deion Sanders. This fanbase hate showboats and his father was one of least classist players I have ever seen in the NFL. Deion was also so obsessed with money (remember his rap video and Pizza Hut commercials with Jerrah?) that he drew a dollar sign in the batters box with his bat after he was called up to the Yankees. No one does that in baseball. So I would assume he would whine about money his entire time with the Giants.

Both Sanders and Manning are grouped together because of their physical talent.

Here is where Sanders and Manning are vastly different.  Sanders is 2nd gen wealth/ privilege from an attention seeking father.

Arch Manning is the son of the poorest of the Manning brothers who did not play pro football and who had to deal with all the attention on his two brothers.  I am sure that made Arch very hungry to succeed for what his dad could not do due to getting injured or the money he never got.  I'd bet on Arch for that reason plus his talent.