Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: kingm56 on October 15, 2024, 01:33:35 PMWe don't; however, we know WE'RE NOT a contender WITH him.

Every team has injuries.  Maybe you're not paying attention to the NFL beyond the Giants?  Dal has been without half their starting defense, including APs Lawerence and Parsons; Phili has been without their AP/PB Wrs Smith and Brown from multiple games. Yet, both teams are at or above 500.  KC is undefeated, with their two best WRs and two best RBs on IR.  And then there's our Giants, who have had reasonably good health, a top 10 defense; yet, we're 2-4. 

The difference with those teams still in contention and our Giants is the former are helmed by PB/AP QBs....

You are quoting teams who are experiencing a single season of injury issues compared to the Giants having major injury issues year after year for well over a decade.

Giants best WR-  Hurt

Giants second best edge rusher- hurt

Now Giants best OT-  hurt

Giants best edge rusher-  hurt

Giants kicker- hurt

Giants punter- hurt

Giants ST ace BFW-  hurt

Giants starting RB-  hurt

Sadly, this is so far been one of the team's healthier seasons

This is NOT normal, no matter how you try to spin it

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 15, 2024, 01:38:20 PMYou are quoting teams who are experiencing a single season of injury issues compared to the Giants having major injury issues year after year for well over a decade.

Giants best WR-  Hurt

Giants second best edge rusher- hurt

Now Giants best OT-  hurt

Giants best edge rusher-  hurt

Giants kicker- hurt

Giants punter- hurt

Giants ST ace BFW-  hurt

Giants starting RB-  hurt

Sadly, this is so far been one of the team's healthier seasons

This is NOT normal, no matter how you try to spin it

Rich,

Your point isn't missed. Injuries have hurt us (no pun intended) for a long time.

I think the issue with your initial post was mentioning Jones. His name is like flint in bone dry brush.

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 15, 2024, 01:38:20 PMYou are quoting teams who are experiencing a single season of injury issues compared to the Giants having major injury issues year after year for well over a decade.

Giants best WR-  Hurt

Giants second best edge rusher- hurt

Now Giants best OT-  hurt

Giants best edge rusher-  hurt

Giants kicker- hurt

Giants punter- hurt

Giants ST ace BFW-  hurt

Giants starting RB-  hurt

Sadly, this is so far been one of the team's healthier seasons

This is NOT normal, no matter how you try to spin it

The good news is when you're near the bottom of the league, as injuries start to pile up there's not as far to fall. 

Quote from: T200 on October 15, 2024, 01:44:12 PMRich,

Your point isn't missed. Injuries have hurt us (no pun intended) for a long time.

I think the issue with your initial post was mentioning Jones. His name is like flint in bone dry brush.

Tim,

At this point, I don't think this team will ever be a contender until the injury issues are fixed.  You can blame the losses on Jones or whomever else we wish, but teams generally don't contend when they are dealing with the sorts of injury issues we deal with year after year.

Quote from: Sem on October 15, 2024, 01:44:53 PMThe good news is when you're near the bottom of the league, as injuries start to pile up there's not as far to fall. 

Sort of the chicken and the egg.  I think the Giants win the Washington game with a healthy kicker.  I think the Giants would win the Bengal game if Thomas wasn't hobbled or Nabers played. 

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 15, 2024, 01:38:20 PMYou are quoting teams who are experiencing a single season of injury issues compared to the Giants having major injury issues year after year for well over a decade.

Giants best WR-  Hurt

Giants second best edge rusher- hurt

Now Giants best OT-  hurt

Giants best edge rusher-  hurt

Giants kicker- hurt

Giants punter- hurt

Giants ST ace BFW-  hurt

Giants starting RB-  hurt

Sadly, this is so far been one of the team's healthier seasons

This is NOT normal, no matter how you try to spin it

The Giant's injuries do not invalidate the other injuries I highlighted.  If you have an AP/PB type QB, you can overcome significant injuries.  The Giant's simply don't have that luxury. 

And I reject your overall narrative; the Giants' record over the last 6 years is not a byproduct of injuries.  It's a byproduct of lack of talent.  This year, it's a direct result of an inept offense, which proved its ineptitude before the injuries started to pileup.  Yes, the Giant players HAVE been injured at a higher rate than other teams; however, I don't believe those injuries derailed us from achieving Superbowl contention.

BL: We need better offensive players and YES, they need to remain healthy. 

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 15, 2024, 01:48:41 PMTim,

At this point, I don't think this team will ever be a contender until the injury issues are fixed.  You can blame the losses on Jones or whomever else we wish, but teams generally don't contend when they are dealing with the sorts of injury issues we deal with year after year.

One of the biggest problems with fan bases is that we try and distill the issues of a poorly performing team like ours down to ONE SINGLE point. When you're as bad as the Giants have been for over a decade, there is never just ONE thing wrong. Yes, injuries are a huge problem that prevents the Giants from being a consistent winner. Jones at QB is a huge problem that prevents the Giants from being a consistent winner.

Quote from: T200 on October 15, 2024, 01:52:56 PMOne of the biggest problems with fan bases is that we try and distill the issues of a poorly performing team like ours down to ONE SINGLE point. When you're as bad as the Giants have been for over a decade, there is never just ONE thing wrong. Yes, injuries are a huge problem that prevents the Giants from being a consistent winner. Jones at QB is a huge problem that prevents the Giants from being a consistent winner.

Spot on, Tim.  I'm not suggesting our injuries didn't impact our aggregate record; however, I don't view any injury as derailing a protentional special season, ala 2023 Cinci. 

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 15, 2024, 01:38:20 PMYou are quoting teams who are experiencing a single season of injury issues compared to the Giants having major injury issues year after year for well over a decade.

Giants best WR-  Hurt

Giants second best edge rusher- hurt

Now Giants best OT-  hurt

Giants best edge rusher-  hurt

Giants kicker- hurt

Giants punter- hurt

Giants ST ace BFW-  hurt

Giants starting RB-  hurt

Sadly, this is so far been one of the team's healthier seasons

This is NOT normal, no matter how you try to spin it

I, along with a couple of folks here were thinking about subscribing to the Lost Man-Games data source project for this season's NFL to track the official week by week progress of the Giants. To get the data which I felt would be especially insightful for analysis and good discussion here, they wanted too much for a season subscription and I ultimately passed on it. But, to your point Rich @MightyGiants , the Giants are nowhere near the top and, despite the Sardine Can Turf Monster getting a few folks on Sunday Night, they're still not on the radar of the most injured in the NFL, yet.

As points of reference, the Giants finished seasons 2022 and 2023 as follows against the official "Lost Man-Games Due To Injury:"

2022:
Lost Man-Games (Adjusted): 102.8
Rank (NOTE: higher means worse): 26

2023:
Lost Man-Games (Adjusted): 84.4
Rank (NOTE: higher means worse): 25



I do not have this season's data, as of yet, but am looking around for it in hopes it will get published by someone soon enough.

Peace!

Quote from: kartanoman on October 15, 2024, 02:05:24 PMI, along with a couple of folks here were thinking about subscribing to the Lost Man-Games data source project for this season's NFL to track the official week by week progress of the Giants. To get the data which I felt would be especially insightful for analysis and good discussion here, they wanted too much for a season subscription and I ultimately passed on it. But, to your point Rich @MightyGiants , the Giants are nowhere near the top and, despite the Sardine Can Turf Monster getting a few folks on Sunday Night, they're still not on the radar of the most injured in the NFL, yet.

As points of reference, the Giants finished seasons 2022 and 2023 as follows against the official "Lost Man-Games Due To Injury:"

2022:
Lost Man-Games (Adjusted): 102.8
Rank (NOTE: higher means worse): 26

2023:
Lost Man-Games (Adjusted): 84.4
Rank (NOTE: higher means worse): 25



I do not have this season's data, as of yet, but am looking around for it in hopes it will get published by someone soon enough.

Peace!

This is all good information.  The one issue I have with the data is it doesn't account for starter vs backup or star vs scrub

Quote from: kartanoman on October 15, 2024, 02:05:24 PMI, along with a couple of folks here were thinking about subscribing to the Lost Man-Games data source project for this season's NFL to track the official week by week progress of the Giants. To get the data which I felt would be especially insightful for analysis and good discussion here, they wanted too much for a season subscription and I ultimately passed on it. But, to your point Rich @MightyGiants , the Giants are nowhere near the top and, despite the Sardine Can Turf Monster getting a few folks on Sunday Night, they're still not on the radar of the most injured in the NFL, yet.

As points of reference, the Giants finished seasons 2022 and 2023 as follows against the official "Lost Man-Games Due To Injury:"

2022:
Lost Man-Games (Adjusted): 102.8
Rank (NOTE: higher means worse): 26

2023:
Lost Man-Games (Adjusted): 84.4
Rank (NOTE: higher means worse): 25



I do not have this season's data, as of yet, but am looking around for it in hopes it will get published by someone soon enough.

Peace!

Does the calculous factor the players abilities?  For example, consider the 2022 NYG IR list:

Sterling Shepard
Kenny Golladay
Aaron Robinson
Kadarius Toney - traded mid-season but had been on IR prior.
Bobby Okereke  - also placed on IR late in the season.
D.J. Davidson
Darrian Beavers
Collin Johnson
Marcus McKethan
Elerson Smith
Nick Williams

Is Okereke injury considered equal to Marcus McKethan?  If it doesn't, it's pretty useless.  Losing a bunch of 3rd string/practice squail players shouldn't have much impact on the team.

The season..that never was, in our potential heads, is over. Average qb ...no depth on the ol..injuries and continued lack of execution. Means another forgettable season again before Halloween.

 

Quote from: MightyGiants on October 15, 2024, 02:08:22 PMThis is all good information.  The one issue I have with the data is it doesn't account for starter vs backup or star vs scrub

That is one point I'm with you on. Had we went ahead and invested in their NFL "Pro" package, they include "weighted" statistical profiles for each player and their impact "value" if they get injured.

Here's the link to their site and the FAQ for the NFL data answers some of those questions.

AGL - Athlete Game Lost

Peace!

The Eagles stat guys will love that. He stinks..but Thomas was Neal-like against the Bengals..ouch

Quote from: kartanoman on October 15, 2024, 02:18:54 PMThat is one point I'm with you on. Had we went ahead and invested in their NFL "Pro" package, they include "weighted" statistical profiles for each player and their impact "value" if they get injured.

Here's the link to their site and the FAQ for the NFL data answers some of those questions.

AGL - Athlete Game Lost

Peace!

I miss this site. There last posting was January 2023


https://x.com/ManGamesLostNFL/status/1617604238770569216