Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on November 24, 2024, 06:42:42 PMI really don't get this board sometimes. Jones gets 60+ games, killing multiple coaches along the way, and even this season I was admonished that I can't draw conclusions about him until some arbitrary date. Daboll, a Coach of the Year, after one game without DJ? Get rid of him!

Daboll might not be the future head coach of this team. I am completely open to that possibility (and have been whenever asked). But we're literally one game into the post-Jones era. They're now at a $40MM handicap every game (because of the guy who many on this board celebrated when he got the contract that now drags down the roster). I'll at least see how the season turns out before I decide he's not the one for this team moving forward.

Very well said. I am in the same camp pretty much across the board of what you wrote here.

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on November 24, 2024, 06:42:42 PMI really don't get this board sometimes. Jones gets 60+ games, killing multiple coaches along the way, and even this season I was admonished that I can't draw conclusions about him until some arbitrary date. Daboll, a Coach of the Year, after one game without DJ? Get rid of him!

Daboll might not be the future head coach of this team. I am completely open to that possibility (and have been whenever asked). But we're literally one game into the post-Jones era. They're now at a $40MM handicap every game (because of the guy who many on this board celebrated when he got the contract that now drags down the roster). I'll at least see how the season turns out before I decide he's not the one for this team moving forward.

Very well articulated, Kyle. I'll also add that just 16 months ago the same posters calling for Dabs to be fired, we're singing his praises. The oscillation of narratives is enough to make anyone dizzy.

I think Dabs is too much a players coach.

Quote from: Philosophers on November 24, 2024, 07:19:46 PMI think Dabs is too much a players coach.

You may well be right about that, Joe. The Giants have historically had more success with coaches who have kept a bit of a distance from the players and have been more of an authority figure. I think Mara and Tisch had hoped they were getting another iteration of that with Joe Judge, but obviously that didn't work out very well.

I can't predict the future, but I suspect Mara will be wanting a coach who (1) has head coaching experience and (2) had success as a head coach. Since Coughlin was fired, he has not had a head coach who has ticket both of those boxes. Shurmur was the only one who had head coaching experience, but he had not had success as a head coach.

Of course, finding someone with successful head coaching experience who is (1) available and (2) willing to work for you is not a given.

Quote from: Philosophers on November 24, 2024, 07:19:46 PMI think Dabs is too much a players coach.

That could be fair, Joe. There doesn't seem to be a lot of professional respect for "Dabs."  Although, I could be conflating my profession with the NFL.  If a subordinate referred to me by a nickname, we would have a private conversation about professional decorum. 

Quote from: Philosophers on November 24, 2024, 07:19:46 PMI think Dabs is too much a players coach.

I think you're right.   Player coaches tend to enjoy early success because the player are all excited to play for them.   Unfortunately, over time the lack of discipline becomes more and more of a problem.

I'm confused, he was a savior just 2 years ago and coach of the year despite a horrible roster and qb. He didn't forget how to coach and us a great coach imo. We are just now getting pieces to be remotely relevant.

Quote from: files58 on November 24, 2024, 06:30:50 PMPlayers, coaches, GM's all come and go. The constant is a Mara. It has always been so. I started in 65', they are approximately 60 games UNDER .500 since then(regular season). A historical losing franchise. If not for Rozelle intervening we don't get Young, then don't get Parcells, then don't get TC. We get more of nothing. It's past time for Mara to publicly declare how much HE has screwed up the franchise, from hiring Mara soldiers(historically Webster, Robustelli, recently Gettleman) to "influencing" the Jones contract. Time to offer allocution, and get the F out of the way. Oh, b/t/w ten years ago the Giants were worth $2.1 Billion, today $7.3 Billion. Totally inferior product results in 3.5 times increase in value. Is he really an owner of a "losing" team?

THIS, right here, is one of the biggest indirect negative influences / conflicts of interest which, in all truth MUST be put down on the table, if I were the press, and look both the Mara and Tisch families direct in the eye and challenge them why they cannot see that forest for the trees.

You put out an INEPT product that's long past inferior and far surpassed embarrassing. You are "rewarded" by being the fourth (4th) richest NFL organization in the entire league! You are asked a simple question, "WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE?"

If your last name is Mara or Tisch, the answer is simple, there's NOTHING wrong, PERIOD!" The product on the field? A mere "bag of shells," in my best Jackie Gleason voice. You're too busy with marketing and sales long-term agreements and keeping up appearances at the Goodell Country Club, where you have honored roles in several of his notable committees. Giants Football? Ugh, ooh, oh yeah, Giants Football too!

Does that make it a little bit clearer from a systematic point of view? That's why there was no coincidence between post 1978 and all the happenings which brought in Young, Perkins and a "new age" Terry Bradshaw, named Simms, who all helped shape the eventual turnaround. After all, it was "The Duke," himself, who had the hunch about Rozelle being the best fit for NFL Commissioner back in the day. George Young was Pete's way of helping out an old, loyal friend in need.

The only question left is whether John and Steve have earned enough "favor points" with Goodell for a modern day version of a George Young-like favor being repayed.

Or, perhaps, the two owners have bought in to the current Commissioner's motto; a quote from Michael Douglas' character in the movie "Wall Street" which went:

"The point is ladies and gentlemen that greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right. Greed works. Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit."

If that be the case, we might as well wait until we witness what happened with "The team formerly known as the Redskins," because, for all that we know, we may have witnessed the last Giant Super Bowl Championship for ages to come.

The Wilderness Years, Part Deux, have taken this team into the ditch and over the edge into the cauldron for which there may be no escape.

Pack a sandwich 🥪,  and an extra pair of socks, as it's going to get very ugly in Giantland for the long haul.

Another test of the fan's loyalty in the Giant brand is upon us. How will YOU respond to the challenge?

Think carefully, before responding!

Ugh!

Quote from: Jclayton92 on November 24, 2024, 07:49:25 PMI'm confused, he was a savior just 2 years ago and coach of the year despite a horrible roster and qb. He didn't forget how to coach and us a great coach imo. We are just now getting pieces to be remotely relevant.

Mike Lombardi once explained this.  He talked about how, in music, you have one-hit wonders.  The musicians worked their whole lives on that first album, and it's good, but now he is expected to produce another in a much shorter time, and many musicians simply can't do it.

Same with coaches, they spend a lifetime developing their plays and systems.  Only in the NFL do other teams adapt, and you need to change it up.   It appears Daboll is a one-hit wonder.  That and as has been mentioned by @Trench a player friendly coach who has lost team discipline

So,for those who voted yes, if they win Thursday, we keep him?  What if they win Thursday but then lose the following week?

But in all seriousness, can a mod put an asterik on the threads that have not turned into a fire daboll/schoen discussion?

Quote from: miss86 on November 24, 2024, 06:06:26 PMI wish I could care. I'm at that point that I'm so disgusted with this team, that I don't. Defense, offense, coaching, is so terrible that I really don't anymore. Such a complete embarrassment. 

I too find it hard to care what the Giants are doing and indeed have been as a franchise for far too long. It leads me to not be particularly interested in the NFL in general. At the same time, and without comfort or consolation, I am mindful that there have been only 3 rather brief occasions/ periods of time during the nearly 60 years of Super Bowl Competition during which the Giants have been truly competitive.

One obvious constant in the Giants case has been the too often crony-favoring Mara family, but the other dynastic families, the Rooneys, the Bidwells, the Halas McCaskeys and the like, have really not had any more consistent success nor has any NFL franchise. Of course, as I have already said, that is of no comfort as we live and root in the present not the past.

As it is so much easier to criticize and fault-find than it is to praise or give credit, I'm in no hurry to do either at this stage if at all.

Cheers! Yeah I know, you'd rather it be Jeers! Okay, so just think of it as cancelling out.

 

Bad in-game manager, bad time manager, mediocre play-caller, can't pick proper staff, fights with them, lost locker room...

Jones is released and our #2 is DeVito (who's call is that?)...and the team looks TERRIBLE against one of the WORST defenses in the league...

I don't know what else we need...

I've been skeptical since last year's circus...

The he completely lost me WEEKS ago...

He has to...and WILL go 

Daboll's first half offense might as well be the QB taking a knee.

I could see this overreaction coming when I started the thread about smelling blood in the water.

Let the season play out. Then the Owners should evaluate and make a decision. Unless the team had a chance to make the playoffs or Daboll become a lunatic, there is no reason to pull a Woody.