Big Blue Huddle

So, with the Eagles and many other teams resting starters and/or resting certain players, how is that considered Ok but a bad team doing the same would be considered Tanking and frowned upon.

Quote from: sooners56 on January 03, 2025, 05:42:56 PMSo, with the Eagles and many other teams resting starters and/or resting certain players, how is that considered Ok but a bad team doing the same would be considered Tanking and frowned upon.

Because the Eagles have a lot to lose by risking injury to their best players in this game. The Giants don't.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on January 03, 2025, 05:45:38 PMBecause the Eagles have a lot to lose by risking injury to their best players in this game. The Giants don't.

But those moves impact the integrity of the game, right? Meaning sitting those players makes it more likely they would
Lose the game than if they played their starters. Also, the Giants have a lot to lose imo. A top 5 draft pick to be exact.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on January 03, 2025, 05:45:38 PMBecause the Eagles have a lot to lose by risking injury to their best players in this game. The Giants don't.

True but two weeks off is not the best answer either. I would play starters like it's pre season. First quarter then out

Intent is everything.

There is a huge difference between actively trying to lose a game as a non-playoff team and resting starters because you have to play a do or die game the next week against a playoff opponent.

The former is tanking. The latter is not. It's about intent.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on January 03, 2025, 06:36:39 PMIntent is everything.

There is a huge difference between actively trying to lose a game as a non-playoff team and resting starters because you have to play a do or die game the next week against a playoff opponent.

The former is tanking. The latter is not. It's about intent.

Your "intent" about defining "intent" makes sense. But what if Daboll and his staff use the game in a sort of "Exhibition Game" sort of way to try new plays which never saw the light of day during the rest of the regular season. What about trying to rotate lesser used players into the season finale, especially in the second half, for a combination of game experience and/or try a different position?

Now, I am not suggesting doing what the Iggles did a few years ago under Peterson which brought scrutiny to the owner and the coach, with the latter losing his job over it. I'm simply suggesting a player here, another player there, as part of a "broader" rotation than usual. At worst, I can understand the questioning of it being a possible "tank-job;" however, that would be a gray area argument since when is it wrong to give your bench some extended play in the final game of the season when they know this is the last game they are going to play.

Daboll SHOULD be able to exercise the right to freely use all his players on the bench, if he so chooses, in this weekend's final game, regardless of the implication of "tanking." Especially given the bad season, it should be understandable that he would want to put players in the game and see how they respond. You never know when someone is going to show something that warrants an additional look in next season's training camp.

But, for all the prognosticators, his starting lineup, and every player substitution thereafter, are going to be overly scrutinized anyway, so he might as well just do what he has to do.

Was it tanking or was it not? Sure to be the top subject after the game thread on Sunday, I'm sure!

Peace!

We're talking about an NFL team knowingly playing at less than their best in, say, the last week of the regular season.

If the team's sure of being in the play-offs, resting top players assures going into this year's play-offs with the best possible team as there is no risk of injury to the top players.

If a team's sure of not being in the play-offs, resting the top players assures the best possible draft pick position and a better shot at the play-offs the following year.

In both instances, it's a team looking beyond the final game of the season and doing the best thing.

Regards, and enjoy this weekend's games!

Go, Big Blue!

Quote from: kartanoman on January 03, 2025, 07:37:10 PMYour "intent" about defining "intent" makes sense. But what if Daboll and his staff use the game in a sort of "Exhibition Game" sort of way to try new plays which never saw the light of day during the rest of the regular season. What about trying to rotate lesser used players into the season finale, especially in the second half, for a combination of game experience and/or try a different position?

Now, I am not suggesting doing what the Iggles did a few years ago under Peterson which brought scrutiny to the owner and the coach, with the latter losing his job over it. I'm simply suggesting a player here, another player there, as part of a "broader" rotation than usual. At worst, I can understand the questioning of it being a possible "tank-job;" however, that would be a gray area argument since when is it wrong to give your bench some extended play in the final game of the season when they know this is the last game they are going to play.

Daboll SHOULD be able to exercise the right to freely use all his players on the bench, if he so chooses, in this weekend's final game, regardless of the implication of "tanking." Especially given the bad season, it should be understandable that he would want to put players in the game and see how they respond. You never know when someone is going to show something that warrants an additional look in next season's training camp.

But, for all the prognosticators, his starting lineup, and every player substitution thereafter, are going to be overly scrutinized anyway, so he might as well just do what he has to do.

Was it tanking or was it not? Sure to be the top subject after the game thread on Sunday, I'm sure!

Peace!

If he was a true head coach he would recognize this is nothing but a meaningless preseason game. He should allow DeVito and Boyle to play. And anyone else who hasn't played much during the real season. He wants to win because he believes it will help him retain his job. And maybe the fool on the hill will actually believe that a win on Sunday means something and that it will build culture. The only culture a win Sunday builds is the culture of BS.

Quote from: katkavage on January 04, 2025, 07:07:11 AMIf he was a true head coach he would recognize this is nothing but a meaningless preseason game. He should allow DeVito and Boyle to play. And anyone else who hasn't played much during the real season. He wants to win because he believes it will help him retain his job. And maybe the fool on the hill will actually believe that a win on Sunday means something and that it will build culture. The only culture a win Sunday builds is the culture of BS.

Maybe the final injury report, with 2/5 of the offensive line starting lineup out, due to injury, will facilitate the task without having everyone playing the "tank" card.

Heaven help us if the line actually plays its best game of the season!

Peace!

Quote from: sooners56 on January 03, 2025, 05:42:56 PMSo, with the Eagles and many other teams resting starters and/or resting certain players, how is that considered Ok but a bad team doing the same would be considered Tanking and frowned upon.

Here is how I see the difference:

    The playoff bound team doesn't care whether they win or lose and their motive is to win the Superbowl they are
    eligible to contend for.

    The non-play bound DOES care whether they lose.  Their motive is to be the worst in order to be better
    years later hoping to be eligible to contend for the Superbowl. 

I think motivated losing is a terrible system design and the NFL should do their best to address it.  Perhaps extra lottery balls for winning in Q4 of the season?  Anything but the present state. 

DaveBrown
Because the Eagles have a lot to lose by risking injury to their best players in this game. The Giants don't.

I beg to differ
When you're ten games under the Mendoza line, it's somewhat likely that there are players making business decisions out on the field, I mean where is the winning culture at that point. This indirectly can put a teammate at risk of injury.

Contrarily when you're headed to the playoffs, no player in their right mind will give less effort even with stars sitting because there is a winning culture in place and there is no room in a winning culture for anyone making a business decision.


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Valid points by all. I still believe if you don't put your best players on the field in any game you are messing with the integrity of the game. Tanking isn't the word for what the Eagles and other teams are doing this weekend but it is technically the same just a different reason.

Also, it's not just the Eagles, lots of teams are resting starters. Makes many of this weekends games not as good of a watch.

Quote from: sooners56 on January 04, 2025, 02:19:32 PMValid points by all. I still believe if you don't put your best players on the field in any game you are messing with the integrity of the game. Tanking isn't the word for what the Eagles and other teams are doing this weekend but it is technically the same just a different reason.

Also, it's not just the Eagles, lots of teams are resting starters. Makes many of this weekends games not as good of a watch.

The games tomorrow with a couple of exceptions are like the third exhibition game of preseason. The Giants game is a joke. A win is as meaningless or even more so than an exhibition game. Daboll should let all three QBs play.

Quote from: sooners56 on January 03, 2025, 05:42:56 PMSo, with the Eagles and many other teams resting starters and/or resting certain players, how is that considered Ok but a bad team doing the same would be considered Tanking and frowned upon.

Bravo! Also, we've got to consider contractual performance bonuses etc. These guys DO play for money. Bob