Big Blue Huddle

https://x.com/PLeonardNYDN/status/1877718873824170083

If this really happened this way, they need to go ASAP.


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Why would players be present with a GM having contract negotiations or things of the like?

I am not sure I believe this one

If true, it is certainly a problem just doesn't seem believable to me

Quote from: MrGap92 on January 10, 2025, 09:34:58 AMWhy would players be present with a GM having contract negotiations or things of the like?

I am not sure I believe this one

If true, it is certainly a problem just doesn't seem believable to me

The report sounds like it's between Schoen and an agent.  I don't believe the player was present.

As was reported, pay cuts during the season are highly unusual.   I appreciate that when a GM asks a player to take a pay cut (this is usually done in the offseason), a GM needs to be prepared to release the player, or no player would ever say yes (if there is no consequence for saying no).   It sounds, from the report, that Schoen was overly aggressive and rude, which doesn't really serve Schoen or the Giants well.  As to why Schoen decided to cut a player's pay midseason, I have no clue.

Quote from: MightyGiants on January 10, 2025, 09:38:34 AMThe report sounds like it's between Schoen and an agent.  I don't believe the player was present.

As was reported, pay cuts during the season are highly unusual.   I appreciate that when a GM asks a player to take a pay cut (this is usually done in the offseason), a GM needs to be prepared to release the player, or no player would ever say yes (if there is no consequence for saying no).   It sounds, from the report, that Schoen was overly aggressive and rude, which doesn't really serve Schoen or the Giants well.  As to why Schoen decided to cut a player's pay midseason, I have no clue.

I get all that, its just aside from McCloud sharing his own words with teammates, I dont see how "multiple players" could report it, although I suppose it could be overheard.

For Schoens sake I hope this isnt true

Quote from: MrGap92 on January 10, 2025, 09:41:44 AMI get all that, its just aside from McCloud sharing his own words with teammates, I dont see how "multiple players" could report it, although I suppose it could be overheard.

For Schoens sake I hope this isnt true

If multiple players are saying it, it is reasonable to suggest (true or not) that is the reputation Schoen has with players and, presumably, agents.   While most deals ultimately come down to dollars, reputation and people skills still matter in terms of negations and signings.  Agents will tend to steer their favored clients from teams where they don't trust the GM, don't like the GM, or don't feel their client will be treated fairly.

https://x.com/clt_ny/status/1877729427515224497

I thought it was a penny pinching move at the time and the approach was wrong.

Hope Schoen has taken this as a learning  moment. The optics aren't fantastic.

That said, I think it'll have little to no bearing on being able to recruit players.

I'm assuming the industry now sees Schoen as a lame duck, so there will be more stories like this as agents try to leverage against his reputation and perceived weaknesses. The McCloud story is a bad look for  Schoen but the bigger issue to me is whether it snowballs moving forward.

Players want two things.  Where the boundaries are and the truth.  Seems like JS/BD failed on both.

Terrible look for the Giants organization

Who or what are the multiple sources?

Quote from: Giant Jim on January 10, 2025, 01:50:40 PMWho or what are the multiple sources?

Best guess

McCloud is close to many of the players, so it could have been second hand from players that he told the story to (no doubt the agent shared with McCloud how his discussions went)

A second possible source was McCloud's agent

I will raise my hand and admit that I got Joe Schoen spectacularly wrong. I was very high on him when he was hired. I really felt like the Giants got someone who understood the various tenets of team building and understood positional value, the modern game, and just generally how to make tough decisions. He seemed to be a key figure in the recent rise of the Bills, who, prior to several years ago, were perhaps the biggest NFL doormats of the 21st century to this point. In various interviews and press conferences I found him to be saying all the right things. Turns out I couldn't have been more wrong.

The only break I'll give myself is I did say things like "the proof will of course be in the pudding", which it always is, but I definitely thought we had an ace young GM when he was hired, and I felt vindicated in that view after the 2022 season.

I've heard that McCloud's agent is his brother and Nick is his only client. If true it's something to keep in mind when evaluating the veracity of the story.  Furthermore, I remember when JS was excoriated for how he handled the Leonard Williams situation.  Then he was too considerate now he's a $cumbag.

I've said it before and I'll say it again.  IMO, Pat Leonard is a $hit stirrer