Everything COVID-19

[philo43]

Your source didn't provide numbers or a table.  It did fit your agenda and in the end that is all that matters.  You even ignored the main points of your own link because it didn't fit your agenda.    I could have provided more than busy two tables that showed you were wrong, but I doubt it would matter.

Tables are the defining factor in accuracy?  Wow, just wow - you dismiss one of the leading major organizations  in tracking  COVID 19?


What was the main points not addressed?

[MightyGiants]

Tables are the defining factor in accuracy?  Wow, just wow - you dismiss one of the leading major organizations  in tracking  COVID 19?


What was the main points not addressed?

This is where you John Hopkins said they got their data

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus-testing

Yet the US doesn't lead the world in testing per capita according to the source they cited.   You know what else is flawed with the link you supplied?  It has no date.   In the ever changing world of Covid, no proper article or graph would be left without a date.


As for the main points, it was the part you didn't put in bold.

[philo43]

This is where you John Hopkins said they got their data

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus-testing

Yet the US doesn't lead the world in testing per capita according to the source they cited.   You know what else is flawed with the link you supplied?  It has no date.   In the ever changing world of Covid, no proper article or graph would be left without a date.


As for the main points, it was the part you didn't put in bold.

OK, you have your agenda , stick to it.

[MightyGiants]

OK, you have your agenda , stick to it.

Clearly you would rather gnaw off your own foot than admit I was correct and you were mistaken.   Not exactly the sort of good environment for good conversation.   This isn't a competition Philo.  We are all facing the same virus and we are trying to get through it.   You don't need to make yourself more enemies during this, as the virus is a big enough challenge for all of us.  I am not your enemy

[philo43]

As I said, you have your agenda, stick to it.  The more you post, the more it is evident.

[MightyGiants]

As I said, you have your agenda, stick to it.  The more you post, the more it is evident.

Yes, that agenda is the TRUTH.  and thank you for the compliment.   

Normally, I wouldn't be such a stickler, but when you post false information (like you did with your article which contradicted itself with its own references) people can get hurt or worse die.  Granted I doubt anything we post on our little front porch will be that impactful, but it's hard to turn off the "we must get it right" mindset.

[philo43]

OK, so now you have given me a choice.

Who do I choose to believe?

Statements from Johns Hopkins University, one of the leaders in the world in medical science, or Rich who works at "xyz" Hospital.

I thought earlier you posted we should listen to the "experts".  Do the experts only count when they agree with you?

[MightyGiants]

OK, so now you have given me a choice.

Who do I choose to believe?

Statements from Johns Hopkins University, one of the leaders in the world in medical science, or Rich who works at "xyz" Hospital.

I thought earlier you posted we should listen to the "experts".  Do the experts only count when they agree with you?

WOW!  That was very disingenuous.   You could believe the link your undated John Hopkins article claimed was its source for its/your claim that showed YOU and the anonymous John Hopkins article were wrong.   You could believe the two outstanding links (that are used by public health professionals around the world) that I provided that showed YOU your article were wrong as well.  You are so OBSESSED with your silly little personal feud/agenda that you will literally distort reality.   You don't have to believe me, you just have to look at all the sources including THE ONE YOU PROVIDED that all show you were wrong.    You twisted reality so badly you think all the actual facts were from "ME" rather than from independent sources.     Philo, I think you need to take a break from reading and responding to my posts, as doing so does not seem to be a good thing for your mental health.

[Bob In PA]

Enough.  I have a couple of new questions and I'm waiting until this ends so I can ask them.  Bob

[MightyGiants]

Bob,

Hopefully, the petty feuds and efforts to prove someone wrong is over.  Feel free to ask your questions.  Here is a good article that describes what could prove to be the most difficult.  In my opinion, this is the biggest problem being faced world-wide.


NEWS | July 7, 2020
"COVID fatigue" is hitting hard. Fighting it is hard, too, says UC Davis Health psychologist
It's time to develop coping skills, which include exercise and talking about our fears and stress.
(SACRAMENTO)

[Bob In PA]

Rich: The reasons for shutdowns and masks, etc., are to minimize the number of cases while simultaneously giving the doctors as much time as possible to discover the "best" ways of treating people who become ill.

The media "conversation" appears to be "stuck" on the contentious stuff and I don't see much reporting about advances and progress in treatment.

I don't want to occupy your time searching for stuff that you don't ordinarily keep track of, so my preliminary question: do you follow developments in treating patients diagnosed with various stages of the disease?

Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: The reasons for shutdowns and masks are to minimize the number of cases while simultaneously giving the doctors as much time as possible to discover the "best" ways of treating people who become ill.

The media "conversation" appears to be "stuck" on that stuff and I don't see much reporting about advances and progress in treatment.

I don't want to occupy your time searching for stuff that you don't ordinarily keep track of, so my preliminary question: do you follow developments in treating patients diagnosed with various stages of the disease?

Bob

Treatment isn't really my professional area of focus, but I do try and keep track of the treatments that are out there.   I know we have made considerable strides since the disease hit us back in February/March.   I can tell you that from my vantage point I am not seeing a light at the end of the tunnel in terms of definitive treatment or a definite date of a vaccine.   

It's sort of funny, when this started we were talking about "flattening the cure"  and the idea then was to keep hospitals and EMS from being overwhelmed.   Now as we learn about some of the serious issues related to the disease (such as injury to the heart) we have somewhat morphed into what you are talking about in terms of fighting a delaying action with the hopes of improved treatments and maybe a vaccine.

What I find most troubling is that I think we all hoped that once you got an area under control, you could carefully open up and sort of resume a semi-normal lifestyle without the disease spiking.   Indications are that we may not be able to do that.   That as soon as we start to open things up cases start to rise.   No doubt the Covid fatigue I posted about is playing a big role in this problem as well.   This is especially true of young people who are full of energy and have the list to risk from the disease.


Personally I am in a bit of a funk over this disease.  I am just not seeing the path out of this problem right now.   I can't say that things will be back to normal in 3 months or 6 months or even a year.  The more people I talk to the more I hear people bending or breaking the rules of social distancing.   That is not a good sign.   Plus the mental strain everyone is under has not been good for anyone.     

[Bob In PA]

Treatment isn't really my professional area of focus, but I do try and keep track of the treatments that are out there.   I know we have made considerable strides since the disease hit us back in February/March.   I can tell you that from my vantage point I am not seeing a light at the end of the tunnel in terms of definitive treatment or a definite date of a vaccine.   

It's sort of funny, when this started we were talking about "flattening the cure"  and the idea then was to keep hospitals and EMS from being overwhelmed.   Now as we learn about some of the serious issues related to the disease (such as injury to the heart) we have somewhat morphed into what you are talking about in terms of fighting a delaying action with the hopes of improved treatments and maybe a vaccine.

What I find most troubling is that I think we all hoped that once you got an area under control, you could carefully open up and sort of resume a semi-normal lifestyle without the disease spiking.   Indications are that we may not be able to do that.   That as soon as we start to open things up cases start to rise.   No doubt the Covid fatigue I posted about is playing a big role in this problem as well.   This is especially true of young people who are full of energy and have the list to risk from the disease.

Personally I am in a bit of a funk over this disease.  I am just not seeing the path out of this problem right now.   I can't say that things will be back to normal in 3 months or 6 months or even a year.  The more people I talk to the more I hear people bending or breaking the rules of social distancing.   That is not a good sign.   Plus the mental strain everyone is under has not been good for anyone.   

Rich: Thank you.  I agree with all of it and can see how the "funk" can arise.  You're certainly not alone.  I've read about (and heard from) plenty of people in the health care field who in the same boat.

All I can say is hang in there and continue finding stuff like what you posted above my question, which IMO is an excellent discussion of some of the problems for long-term pandemics.

As for a "definitive treatment" if you hear or read anything I'll look here for it. There may never be one. In fact it's even possible a vaccine (if it ever happens) might precede agreement on definitive treatments for each stage.  There are so many variables, IMO it's hard to talk make generalizations about treatment without laying out the patient's specific age, health status and risk factors. 

Bob

[MightyGiants]

Rich: Thank you.  I agree with all of it and can see how the "funk" can arise.  You're certainly not alone.  I've read about (and heard from) plenty of people in the health care field who in the same boat.

All I can say is hang in there and continue finding stuff like what you posted above my question, which IMO is an excellent discussion of some of the problems for long-term pandemics.

As for a "definitive treatment" if you hear or read anything I'll look here for it. There may never be one. In fact it's even possible a vaccine (if it ever happens) might precede agreement on definitive treatments for each stage.  There are so many variables, IMO it's hard to talk make generalizations about treatment without laying out the patient's specific age, health status and risk factors. 

Bob

What bothers me is I am not even certain that a vaccine will happen.   I hope it will and I think the odds are still better, than not, that it will, but I am not certain.   What I fear is how long does immunity last.  If the vaccine can't provide at least a year's protection (in my opinion) it will not be as helpful as we need it to be.  I am also worried about getting enough people to take the vaccine to develop herd immunity. 

[Bob In PA]

What bothers me is I am not even certain that a vaccine will happen.   I hope it will and I think the odds are still better, than not, that it will, but I am not certain.   What I fear is how long does immunity last.  If the vaccine can't provide at least a year's protection (in my opinion) it will not be as helpful as we need it to be.  I am also worried about getting enough people to take the vaccine to develop herd immunity.

Rich: In addition, the fact that many people are asymptomatic is not helping.  I mention this because the radio just told me what I already know.... Doug Peterson has it and is asymptomatic.  Yikes.  Bob