Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: T200 on April 23, 2024, 09:53:52 PMI think the culprits are, in order:

1 - Scouting (talent identification)
2 - Coaching/player development
3 - Coaching instability/carousel

They tried to make a bacon cheeseburger but bought ground turkey instead of ground beef, thinking they could make it taste the same. They bought lean turkey strips because it looks like bacon. They settled for spinach because they couldn't find lettuce.

They have a gas stove but the chef didn't know how to work it. After burning several burgers, more chefs and ingredients were brought in but to no avail. They know what a good bacon cheeseburger is supposed to look like but collectively they have no clue how to make one like it should be made.

Absolutely. I've said the same thing. The Giants have a deeply systemic problem at every level when it comes to putting a competent offensive line on the field.

Quote from: coggs on April 24, 2024, 07:08:57 PMI am aware.  Few teams have, which is why I think if one of these guys fit that, they would do whatever they can to try to get him.

Many teams spend decades chasing that player. Despite the rhetoric about continuing to draft quarterbacks until you find him and all of the talk about how the game has changed and its a quarterback driven passing league, the old paradigm remains in place where a regime really only gets to push the reset button once before the head coach gets fired, and the gm gets to push the reset button once on the head coach before he himself gets fired. 

Quote from: kingm56 on April 24, 2024, 05:49:42 AMI'd argue his performance met expectations.  Waller was 3 years removed from his last notable season, and was extremely unlikely at 31 years old to duplicate his limited (only 2 of 9 seasons) success.  I failed to grasp Giant fans' rationale for predicting anything more than what Waller produced.     If he comes back next season, I'd anticipate similar production +/- 10%;.

Totally agree. Getting hurt is what the guy does and having players get injured is what the Giants do.

Quote from: Philosophers on April 23, 2024, 11:29:19 AMHow much time does Schoen thinks he has left in his Giants tenure?  If less he may swing for the fences this year and gamble on a QB.

I don't think Schoen's seat is as hot as many speculate. I don't really think Daboll's is either.

Quote from: brownelvis54 on April 23, 2024, 10:32:40 AMRich I agree that Jones is a team player. The article speaks about the media:


If the Giants go in this direction, they had better be prepared for the maelstrom that follows.

There is nothing more distracting to a team than having two quarterbacks for one job. Wait until Jones looks rusty in a training camp practice or he misses an open receiver in the season opener, or — heaven forbid — throws the ball up for grabs for an interception. From the moment the Giants are off the clock after taking a quarterback at No. 6, Jones' ownership of the starting job is on the clock. It is almost always an irrevocable decree: Your time is nearing an end.

Eventually it's unavoidable, unless you're willing to go into the draft or free agent pool with an obvious glaring need. Grocery shopping hungry comes with its own set of challenges. 

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 08:09:17 AMWhat are you talking about? 12 years ago 316 yards and 2 tds was a phenomenal game, it would even be a great game today. I was simply saying that in those 12 years they've only made it easier on qbs and wrs to put up more production. So if anything it should be easier.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 19, 2024, 08:09:17 AMWhat are you talking about? 12 years ago 316 yards and 2 tds was a phenomenal game, it would even be a great game today. I was simply saying that in those 12 years they've only made it easier on qbs and wrs to put up more production. So if anything it should be easier.

Quote from: kartanoman on April 19, 2024, 08:40:45 AMThat's not bad. The best I've seen with my eyes live, and my statistical sample is very small, was 26 of 37 passes for 321 yards, two (2) TDs, one (1) INT; nine (9) carries for 59 yards and one (1) TD. Of course, that was last season's comeback in the desert 🏜  at Glendale over the Cardinals; the tale of two halves game.

If nothing else, Jones proved he could air it out in that game. Yes, he missed once or twice, but he also hit Hyatt and Slayton long as well.

He knows this is the season to produce or his career will move to a new city, simple as that. What's not simple is the hell he's had to endure with this team in trying to establish his career. Some make it through (e.g. Simms, Hostetler, Collins, Manning) while others do not (e.g. Patterson Plank Joe, Craig Morton, Dave Brown, Kent Graham, Danny Kanell, etc.).

Even the great ones who did were smacked back down to Earth when the team around them struggled or lost players or their head coach (e.g. 1987, 1991, 1994).

BTW, I visited your Alma Mater last month when the NY Rangers came to town. Check it out the next time you're out here as they've completely cleaned up the areas around the campus and it looks state of the art now.

Peace!

MY Alma Mater?

Quote from: AZGiantFan on April 22, 2024, 09:25:52 PMPhil Simms.

That's the one. Slightly before my time.

That's kind of how I see it too and I guess I'm fine with that.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 18, 2024, 08:40:05 PMBecause the game has changed drastically in the past 12 years. The NFl has passed so many rules to help not only the Qb but the WR among other things.

You said raw stats tell the story. Did raw stats only tell the story for the past three years?

Quote from: Jclayton92 on April 17, 2024, 09:01:39 PMThat was 12 years ago but if Jones was throwing for 300 yards and 2 tds a game we wouldn't be having this discussion.

With all due respect, why does it being 12 years ago matter?

Quote from: katkavage on April 18, 2024, 04:00:56 PMThat right there. Unless you are the 85 Bears or 2000 Ravens, it's just not gonna happen with Jones. Go through his career and look how many games where he put the team on his shoulders and beat a real good team. (And I can hear the chorus of excuses blowing in the wind).

Here's a hypothetical, because why not?:

How do you all think Jones would perform if he were swapped with Brock Purdy? I continually here that Purdy is nothing special and he just quarterbacks a loaded offense. 

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 18, 2024, 03:44:59 PMI think so. It's not just me, PFF gave Barkley a 58.3 receiving grade for 2022, which is pretty bad when you consider they start out with a 60.0

But is he a bad route runner or can he just not catch? I never liked the way he was used as a receiver. Way too many third downs where he was expected to catch a dump off and then run over a guy or make a guy miss, often when everyone in North America knew he was getting the ball.

Quote from: T200 on April 18, 2024, 03:39:43 PMI get it.

He does just enough to give hope but lacks the supporting cast to elevate the team. QB Hell.

The best he gives you is playing up to the xs and os. The only time he gives you big play ability is with his running, which further exposes himself to injuries. He pocket awareness is poor too. He gets surprised by the back end pressure way too often.

Quote from: MightyGiants on April 18, 2024, 03:34:24 PMThe problem with Barkley is he ran well, but he was terrible as a receiver

Do you really think he was "terrible?"

Quote from: katkavage on April 18, 2024, 09:40:27 AMExplain

OK. All I'm saying is that should the Giants give up substantial capital to move up and take a quarterback like JJ, then the legacy of Schoen is going to reside almost solely on that move, similar to how Gettleman is linked to Jones. If Jones had turned out to be a superstar, Gettleman would be a hero. I was more making an observation about the situation, not advocating for what Schoen should or shouldn't do. That's why I asked if it would be worth it. Rest assured the folks that say "absolutely" will be there to roast Schoen if he drafts the wrong guy and gives up the farm to get him. That's just the reality of it. But who knows, maybe the folks that roast Jones today will blame the offensive line for the would be failures of his successor. Fandom is always an interesting analysis of the human condition.