Big Blue Huddle

Thanks Slugs.

Good to see Jones get whatever monkey was on his back off his back and have his first really good day.

Nice to see Toney out there in pads. I don't mind that he was a little rusty... if he can just have a quiet next week and a half with no "news", then to me that is a win. I'll put more stock on what I see in the first preseason game from him than I do on a couple of practices at this point. I just want to hear that he is showing up on time for these practices, keeping his mouth shut, and putting forth a strong effort. I'm not looking for highlight reel from him right now.

I think it's really hard to judge the O line in practices for the reasons you mention. I need to see them in games, and really I am not going to feel strongly about them one way or the other until I see how they fare in the first two games of the season. If they can hold their own against the likes of Denver and Washington, I'm going to be super optimistic. If they look good in the preseason then that will be nice to see, but again I need to see it in a real game with them.

I'm pretty disheartened by this Golladay situation, but I can't say I am surprised, and nobody else should be. This guy may be the Carson Wentz of receivers.

Osi was with Papa the other day commenting on the practice, and he was raving about the Leo's intensity level. I know there had been some concern here about this guy lying down on everyone after getting his money, but my gut is that that won't be the case with him. I think this guy is a gamer. Also don't forget that it's only a three year contract, and he only just turned 27. He will be ultimately playing for one more contract, so I think we will get a max effort from him.

I am hoping one more receiver steps up in camp/preseason. Maybe it will be Ross, maybe it will be Willis, I'm not sure. But if Golladay is just not going to stay on the field, they need another outside guy besides Slayton. I know everyone thinks we're loaded at this position, but we're not really IMO. We have some nice slot options, but we are thin on the outside still.

Are we expecting Barkley to see any action in any preseason games? I know nobody wants to rush him back, but if this turns into a situation where he is missing multiple regular season games, that's not ideal and certainly not what anyone was hoping for. That will especially be problematic if Golladay is out. All of a sudden the Giants won't have any proven big time playmakers on offense, despite an offseason mandate from Mara to go out and get some.

I had a debate with a good friend of mine the other day about which of these two bands was "better." I put the word "better" in quotes because obviously this is entirely subjective, and we acknowledged that from the beginning of the conversation. Both are clearly iconic, great bands. That is not in question.

It's still a fun converation though. I thought I'd throw it in the FP to see if anyone here had a view. Since there isn't a ton of traffic here, I realize this thread idea may not take, but I still thought it would be worth posting.

For me personally, the winner is Zeppelin. I have always liked Floyd, and I went through a multi-year phase when I was in high school and college where I was very into them, but I have always loved Led Zeppelin, and that continues today. Floyd is more of an experiential type of band, almost like an opera. Zeppelin to me is just incredibly tight, high quality rock with a great blues element but also a lot of beautiful melody. Zeppelin also has truly top notch musicians in the band. Page is arguably the best guitarist of all time (certainly in the top short list), and Bonzo was one of the greatest drummers of all time (Rolling Stone has him as number one in their top 100). Plant is also clearly an iconic front man with a unique, powerful voice. So as individuals I think Zeppelin wins out, and for me personally their music is just more versatile while not sacrificing any quality.

One characteristic of a great band in my opinion is when you listen to the music, it can take you back to a certain time in your life and make memories more vivid. Both of these bands actually do that for me, but Zeppelin songs for me personally are ones I just always want to hear. For Floyd you need to be in a certain mood.

I would love to hear any opinions on this subject if there are any here.

Quote from: nb587 on July 30, 2021, 05:50:37 PM
Maybe this is more in the hope department but I think that Siils and Pettis and to a lesser extent Mack can be productive NFL receivers which is part of the reason I was not crazy about drafting Toney in the 1st round.

Toney has the explosive playmaking ability that nobody else on the roster (including this year's expected starters) has. Talent-wise he is unique on this team. The question will be whether or not he can behave like a professional and also whether he can become a refined NFL route runner. Ability-wise and positional fit-wise I definitely think he was worth the pick though.

Quote from: spiderblue43 on July 28, 2021, 08:44:51 PM
Sopranos and No Country For Old Men

Interesting on the Sopranos. I actually didn't like the ending either the first time I saw it, but it grew on me after a few subsequent viewings.

Quote from: LennG on July 23, 2021, 08:52:43 PM
Maybe I am really being naive here, but what was really wrong with "Indians' as a nickname? How is the word Indian derogatory?

I can understand Redskin, Redmen, et al, but names like Indians and Braves, to me, at least, represent power and are, in no way derogatory.

I guess for the same reasons that the accepted term for this ethnic group switched from "Indians" to "Native Americans." Clearly the term "Indians" (in reference to Native Americans) is now considered at best passe, if not offensive. Of course that wasn't the case when this name for the baseball team was first decided on in the early 20th century, but times obviously change.

I suspect something that they thought phonetically resembled Indians.

I am very sorry about your Father, King. I can't begin to imagine how difficult for everyone involved that must have been.

Quote from: kingm56 on July 23, 2021, 10:56:08 AM
Unlike abortions, the choice to vaccinate has clear impacts on others

I think the pro-life community would disagree with this point. They would surely regard the aborted fetus as an "other" who has been impacted by the decision to abort.

And therein lies the crux of the entire abortion debate. No point in going down that whole road in a football forum, however I think you are unlikely to persuade any pro lifers here that abortion does not also have "clear impacts on others."

Quote from: Slugs Narrows on July 23, 2021, 10:38:41 AM
And it

You guys have to admit, it's amusing that conservatives are now adopting the "my body my choice" line of reasoning in support of the anti-vaxers after decades of opposing that very viewpoint with their own anti-abortion view.

Quote from: Trench on July 23, 2021, 09:56:55 AM
This guy is a bit of a distraction

He seems like more of a ghost than a distraction at this point.

We don't know that much though. And I am largely in Bob's camp at this stage, just basically because I am generally a believer in innocent until proven guilty. I don't like to just assume the worst about people. With that said I do understand why some are concerned. And I myself would have preferred that his transition to life as a Giant would have been more seamless to this point than it has been.

If Toney is in fact displaying a bad attitude or a general lack of hunger, I hope that Judge is not taking a soft approach with him. Coughlin was notably harsh with rookies. He was old school that way. I hope Judge is reading him the riot act and threatening to bench him for a long time or possibly even get rid o him if he is not diplaying the right attitude. We don't know that that has been the case though. We are all working off pretty incomplete information at this point.

Quote from: jimmyz on July 23, 2021, 03:38:00 AM
Biden says you can't get sick if you get vaccinated.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/22/politics/fact-check-biden-cnn-town-hall-july/index.html

Wow.

Quote from: nb587 on July 22, 2021, 04:59:04 PM
The one thing that I keep coming back to is that the OL is such a question mark from top to bottom.  There is not 1 player that is even in the conversation as a sure thing much less a pro bowl type. I don

Quote from: MightyGiants on July 22, 2021, 03:04:14 PM
Dave,

I don't think anyone is arguing that he is likely to be or he is surely going to be a problem.  However, there are many of us who feel there is a reason for concern, with all the issues that have gone on.   I would add his retweet Cole Beasley's anti-vax message to the negative side of Toney's ledger  (won't it be great if Toney costs the Giants a game because he gets Covid and infects enough of his fellow players that the Giants have to forfeit?).  As for some of the other Tweets, I appreciate they could prove to be harmless, but I can't completely rule out that they could be red flags.

I would say if there weren't character issues with Toney coming out of college, it would be easier to dismiss everything.  Since he did have character issues, how things have gone since he was drafted has done nothing to assuage concerns.   For all I know, most of the "odd" behavior was the Giants hiding an injury issue Toney was dealing with (Giants don't have to give injury information this time of year). 

Hopefully in a week or two this whole issue will be behind us

I was never really clear on what his character issues were in college. I know there was some smoke there, but the only actual incident I read about was the gun thing, which the cops ultimately determined was not unlawful.

If Toney ends up being a bad apple, this won't be a good look for Judge. He was adamant in a post-draft interview that he and others did their due dilligence on Toney and determined that the character stuff was a non-issue and that he was a good kid. If that turns out to have been a poor read on their part, he'll be criticized for that for sure.

Just so I'm clear, the only thing that Toney has actually done (or not done) that can really be criticized is not showing up for OTAs, right?

Maybe I'm forgetting something. But the cleat thing was not his fault, and if he genuinely had a family emergency (I think it is only fair to believe him unless there is evidence or probable cause that he was lying), then missing some time at work is hardly grounds for criticism. The tweeting and rapping is not a problem until it somehow becomes one.

Am I missing something? This might be a tempest in a teapot...