Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: Doc16LT56 on March 26, 2025, 12:58:44 PMI think your post is fair. I don't think the premise of the thread is fair. Why should anyone give this organization the benefit of the doubt before they prove it on the field? If people choose to do that, that is fine for them, but that's not what this thread was meant to accomplish from what I can tell.

OK Doc, we usually agree on many things, but here I will politely disagree. Schoen has shown that the moves he has made are of a beneficial nature to this team. He can't play the position for some of these guys. Right now, a GMs job it to try and improve the team. Do you think he has tried to do that?
With our schedule next year, I don't see us as a playoff team, but I feel we will be competitive, and that is the first stepping stone. We are nowhere near the Eagles' class, but Schoen has us headed in the right direction. can't you admit that?

Quote from: katkavage on March 26, 2025, 12:49:04 PMMore objective minds might not agree that Schoen is killing it this off season. Signing a journeyman QB and then a starter with very diminished skills does not give me much optimism for the future. But I will agree wholeheartedly that those two are light years better than what the Giants had at QB. What does that tell you about the Giants?? No, let's have the discussion about Schoen around mid-season and hope his team can win five games.

Kat.

Like I said to Doc, we usually agree on many things Giants, but here, since you mentioned something,
what has he done wrong this FA period? What would you have liked him to have done differently?
He got us not just a second string bridge QB, but two decent enough guys who could start for several other teams in the league and at a very reasonable price. He has improved our defense, tried to make a few moves for the OL and WR position.
We are in a fantastic position to secure possibly the best player in the draft, Hunter and still have the time to draft a possible future QB and not have him rushed into starting.

To say to wait until it translates on the field, well we could have a great draft and still not translate to the field. Is that the fault of whom?

Schoen deserves credit for what he did in last years draft and this FA and we are in great position to really improve our team without being forced to draft a not-so-great QB early.

Quote from: katkavage on March 26, 2025, 12:21:00 PMYou mean the organization that hasn't had a losing year in almost two decades???

Yeah great. They have a great head coach.

Who's their QB if they don't get Rodgers?

I'll give him a silver star for FA this year. Both QBs are essentially on a one year contract based on guaranteed money and that's good. He improved the secondary, a wash on Edge and the same on the Tackles. He didn't improve the Oline and it remains to be seen if the depth is better.

I'm not going to forget how this team was in such a lousy position the last two seasons.

The preseason isn't over yet because he may do more and the Draft is a part of this process. I don't think anyone said the FA period was done poorly.

Quote from: LennG on March 26, 2025, 01:13:30 PMKat.

Like I said to Doc, we usually agree on many things Giants, but here, since you mentioned something,
what has he done wrong this FA period? What would you have liked him to have done differently?
He got us not just a second string bridge QB, but two decent enough guys who could start for several other teams in the league and at a very reasonable price. He has improved our defense, tried to make a few moves for the OL and WR position.
We are in a fantastic position to secure possibly the best player in the draft, Hunter and still have the time to draft a possible future QB and not have him rushed into starting.

To say to wait until it translates on the field, well we could have a great draft and still not translate to the field. Is that the fault of whom?

Schoen deserves credit for what he did in last years draft and this FA and we are in great position to really improve our team without being forced to draft a not-so-great QB early.

Len, I'm not saying what he's done is wrong or right. The bottom line is to win. How you get there is important...if you win. All the moves he's made, we just don't know yet. The big red herring is still the QB. As I said, Winston (who is not a starter) is a journeyman and Wilson, is not what he was five years ago, but yes, he is a starter and much much better than the dregs the Giants have had with Jones and DeVito. Hunter is an amazing prospect. Better than Nabers because of all he can do. Winston and Wilson are stop gaps. Who is the QB of the future? We don't know yet and might find out in the draft, though if it's a second or third day pick, the odds of that QB being the future are very very slight. Will the team win enough games against a brutal schedule for the coach and GM to keep their jobs? Will you give love to Schoen for all he's done in the off season if the team wins 3-5 games? If they win 8-10 bring on the love.   

Quote from: SlotCorner on March 26, 2025, 01:36:57 PMYeah great. They have a great head coach.

Who's their QB if they don't get Rodgers?

We don't know...yet. But maybe we should see who has the better record by the end of next year?

Quote from: katkavage on March 26, 2025, 01:58:20 PMWe don't know...yet. But maybe we should see who has the better record by the end of next year?

Sure but where did I say Pittsburgh had a worse team? Just that we are in a better spot than they are as far as QB. This is a team that went all in on Pickett.

Maybe let's see which QB room has the better year.

As I stated to Rich in the Wilson thread, my frustration is not with Joe, it's that he's been made somewhat ineffectual (I used the phrase "cut off at the knees") thanks to Mara. I have been saying for sometime that if Mara TRULY cared about winning (the same thing I said about Dolan before Leon Rose arrived). He would hire a President of Football operations and take his, and everyone else named Mara's hand prints off this operation.

*all except for Kate...see Ahmad Bradshaw, she proved to be one helluva scout. 

Who know, maybe that guy turns out to be Schoen if he pulls a miracle this year.

1. We still have no good QB.
2. Our OL is still not a negative unit.
3. He botched not trading Barkley and McKinney
4. We have been laughing stocks of the NFL the last two years.
5. We are still considered the worst team in the NFL.

He may have overpaid for Burns. Banks, Thibs, Neal, JMS all looks to over drafted. Hyatt has been useless the last two seasons. We are darfting 3rd for a reason. He is a major reason why.

Its much much easier to see what he has done wrong than anything he has done right. And throw how embarrassing he was to the organization in "Hard Knocks" - I have very little faith in him to do anything.

Mara made a bad decision to have a mandate for this year.  That said, how does he define improvement?

I would have given Schoen and Daboll the last two years of their contracts to put in place,  and execute,  a plan.  So by the end of 2026, they need to be on a good path or they are gone.

I really like what Schoen did this offseason.  I fully expected him to spend free agent money like a drunken sailor,  but he was measured and improved team depth.  Including at QB. Now,  the pressure is on to have another good draft and show he can handle both the draft and free agency in this job.

He also put us in a position to get our QB of the future next year's draft when it's a much deeper crop. I don't expect the giants to be that improved this year with our schedule and do expect them to be top ten again next draft.  That said,  if we are better this year and do pick lower next year,  he should have the capital to trade up.  Assuming that he can have a good draft this year and start adding more talent to this team, so that giving up picks to trade up next year would be reasonable.

In all,  I'm pleased with this off-season so far and it's up to Schoen to keep things moving forward.

Quote from: katkavage on March 26, 2025, 01:57:14 PMLen, I'm not saying what he's done is wrong or right. The bottom line is to win. How you get there is important...if you win. All the moves he's made, we just don't know yet. The big red herring is still the QB. As I said, Winston (who is not a starter) is a journeyman and Wilson, is not what he was five years ago, but yes, he is a starter and much much better than the dregs the Giants have had with Jones and DeVito. Hunter is an amazing prospect. Better than Nabers because of all he can do. Winston and Wilson are stop gaps. Who is the QB of the future? We don't know yet and might find out in the draft, though if it's a second or third day pick, the odds of that QB being the future are very very slight. Will the team win enough games against a brutal schedule for the coach and GM to keep their jobs? Will you give love to Schoen for all he's done in the off season if the team wins 3-5 games? If they win 8-10 bring on the love.   

Hey there, kat.

I appreciate your keeping things grounded here. For the off-season, phase one (i.e. free agency) is a positive for the organization. Phase two (i.e. the draft and undrafted free agents) will be next on the report card for us in the peanut gallery to discuss. It's all about having a plan and go execute to it. So far, Schoen and company are demonstrating they have a plan to shrewdly add talent without breaking the bank WHILE addressing areas of need. While we may question some signings, we must also consider the coaches on the sideline have inputs to whom they feel would benefit their own system and planning within it. We won't know for certain until the bullets fly for real, but we can presume that to be a practical reason.

We also have to remember the philosophy of execution, now that there are different players in key positions (e.g. QB), things are going to be a bit different than before. How much so will depend on several variables and the most obvious is the injury factor. If the Giants cannot stay on the field, especially in the trenches, it's going to be yet another long and painful season. This, more than anything draft pick, or free agent signing, MUST be addressed and mitigated going into 2025.

For now, anyway, Schoen is doing his job and doing it well enough. This isn't a playoff team, by any stretch; however, if the draft enables them to pick up the right talent, in the right positions, this group may end up surprising us all and may sneak up on the divisional rivals. That would be a huge win for Schoen and Daboll and serve as the objective evidence they've got the ship vectored in the right direction. But it's going to take at least another solid, if not spectacular draft, before they'll be ready to compete again in the division.

Just get it right next month and focus on health going forward. You'll be surprised how much of a difference a season makes.

Peace!

Lenn: My answer to the question in the title of this thread:

It's too early to answer because there is still a draft, followed by a short post-draft final shuffling.

As for what he has done through today... "so far, so good." The roster has improved a bit.

Bob

Talk is cheap as Johnny U always said. Schoen will have his day, good or bad, determined on the field. I will be fair and see how the draft goes, then into camp before I will throw him under the bus. Mara gave him an opportunity to rebound the franchise that has the worst record in the NFL since 2017.

  So he's part of that legacy and deserves little wiggle room. Show me results on the field...show me a roster with potential..show me anything but the last two years.





 

Quote from: SlotCorner on March 26, 2025, 01:36:57 PMYeah great. They have a great head coach.

Who's their QB if they don't get Rodgers?

They haven't won a playoff game since 2016.

They have less than Giants at QB.

The seemingly universal love for the Steeler way seems bizarre to me.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on March 26, 2025, 06:26:57 PMThey haven't won a playoff game since 2016.

They have less than Giants at QB.

The seemingly universal love for the Steeler way seems bizarre to me.

True, but when was the last time they had a losing season, even with weak QBs?