Big Blue Huddle

I don't think Daboll can be truly evaluated until he has a new QB in place (similar to how we heard for years that DJ couldn't be judged without a litany of support). He was the Coach of the Year in 2022 by virtue of covering up Jones's shortcoming even in spite of a weak Gettleman roster. Since then, the league has adjusted, but he's still got the same talent deficiency under center. Very possible the Giants whiff on the evaluation of a new QB too, but that's a problem for a different day and certainly not a hypothetical that should ever prevent them from addressing problems with the current roster, including the starting quarterback. Certainly, if Schoen and Daboll fail to properly identify the next quarterback for this team, their remaining time with the Giants will be short.

Defense has been fine. Led the league in sacks for a period and is middle-of-the-pack in scoring. Nevermind that the unit is under a constant weight to be near-perfect because of the complete inability of the offense to generate points. Is anyone clamoring for Wink and his bottom-tier defense to be back halfway through this season?

Yes, the Giants have more problems than Daniel Jones--I don't really know anyone on this board who has argued he is the singular problem with this team (and I don't need to hear that an allegedly outsized focus on him means people think that way, it doesn't). But if the idea that the Giants have other issues besides Jones to address is a proxy argument that they should address those before Jones, I vehemently disagree. There's no reason to continue the Daniel Jones experiment. It has failed time after time after time.

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on November 04, 2024, 11:32:25 AMI don't think Daboll can be truly evaluated until he has a new QB in place (similar to how we heard for years that DJ couldn't be judged without a litany of support). He was the Coach of the Year in 2022 by virtue of covering up Jones's shortcoming even in spite of a weak Gettleman roster. Since then, the league has adjusted, but he's still got the same talent deficiency under center. Very possible the Giants whiff on the evaluation of a new QB too, but that's a problem for a different day and certainly not a hypothetical that should ever prevent them from addressing problems with the current roster, including the starting quarterback. Certainly, if Schoen and Daboll fail to properly identify the next quarterback for this team, their remaining time with the Giants will be short.

Defense has been fine. Led the league in sacks for a period and is middle-of-the-pack in scoring. Nevermind that the unit is under a constant weight to be near-perfect because of the complete inability of the offense to generate points. Is anyone clamoring for Wink and his bottom-tier defense to be back halfway through this season?

Yes, the Giants have more problems than Daniel Jones--I don't really know anyone on this board who has argued he is the singular problem with this team (and I don't need to hear that an allegedly outsized focus on him means people think that way, it doesn't). But if the idea that the Giants have other issues besides Jones to address is a proxy argument that they should address those before Jones, I vehemently disagree. There's no reason to continue the Daniel Jones experiment. It has failed time after time after time.

This is a superb post, well done.

I couldn't agree more and would like it twice, if I could.

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on November 04, 2024, 11:32:25 AMI don't think Daboll can be truly evaluated until he has a new QB in place (similar to how we heard for years that DJ couldn't be judged without a litany of support). He was the Coach of the Year in 2022 by virtue of covering up Jones's shortcoming even in spite of a weak Gettleman roster. Since then, the league has adjusted, but he's still got the same talent deficiency under center. Very possible the Giants whiff on the evaluation of a new QB too, but that's a problem for a different day and certainly not a hypothetical that should ever prevent them from addressing problems with the current roster, including the starting quarterback. Certainly, if Schoen and Daboll fail to properly identify the next quarterback for this team, their remaining time with the Giants will be short.

Defense has been fine. Led the league in sacks for a period and is middle-of-the-pack in scoring. Nevermind that the unit is under a constant weight to be near-perfect because of the complete inability of the offense to generate points. Is anyone clamoring for Wink and his bottom-tier defense to be back halfway through this season?

Yes, the Giants have more problems than Daniel Jones--I don't really know anyone on this board who has argued he is the singular problem with this team (and I don't need to hear that an allegedly outsized focus on him means people think that way, it doesn't). But if the idea that the Giants have other issues besides Jones to address is a proxy argument that they should address those before Jones, I vehemently disagree. There's no reason to continue the Daniel Jones experiment. It has failed time after time after time.

This is articulated better than I ever could, very nicely down H Town. 

Coaching is the biggest issue with the Giants. They lack the discipline that coaching is suppose to provide. How many TDs have been taken away due to coaching. It's crazy but DJ while not consistent neither is coaching and the entire team isn't consistent. This coach is a huge problem, he isn't getting any flack. The coach is literally scapegoating players. This coach is toxic he scapegoated Kafka, then he did it to Wink now he is doing it to Jones.

Quote from: MrGap92 on November 04, 2024, 09:06:22 AMThe thing is, the play callers have all been horrible, his weapons are horrible, his line is horrible, he has no support.

If none of these things existed, we would all see what he can really do and prove the naysayers wrong. He can go big time, he just hasn't had the right people to unlock it.

When things like this were said about Jones they were called excuses. 

Quote from: H-Town G-Fan on November 04, 2024, 11:32:25 AMI don't think Daboll can be truly evaluated until he has a new QB in place (similar to how we heard for years that DJ couldn't be judged without a litany of support). He was the Coach of the Year in 2022 by virtue of covering up Jones's shortcoming even in spite of a weak Gettleman roster. Since then, the league has adjusted, but he's still got the same talent deficiency under center. Very possible the Giants whiff on the evaluation of a new QB too, but that's a problem for a different day and certainly not a hypothetical that should ever prevent them from addressing problems with the current roster, including the starting quarterback. Certainly, if Schoen and Daboll fail to properly identify the next quarterback for this team, their remaining time with the Giants will be short.

Defense has been fine. Led the league in sacks for a period and is middle-of-the-pack in scoring. Nevermind that the unit is under a constant weight to be near-perfect because of the complete inability of the offense to generate points. Is anyone clamoring for Wink and his bottom-tier defense to be back halfway through this season?

Yes, the Giants have more problems than Daniel Jones--I don't really know anyone on this board who has argued he is the singular problem with this team (and I don't need to hear that an allegedly outsized focus on him means people think that way, it doesn't). But if the idea that the Giants have other issues besides Jones to address is a proxy argument that they should address those before Jones, I vehemently disagree. There's no reason to continue the Daniel Jones experiment. It has failed time after time after time.

According to PFF, Daboll had elite QB play (QB rating and QBR tell a similar story) yesterday, and the team still looked bad.

Quote from: Doc16LT56 on November 04, 2024, 11:08:12 AMThat's incorrect. He threw the ball 6 times for zero yards in the first half. He's the first QB to do that since 1991. This is not normal.

It goes to show what an idiotic stat passer rating is. It's a stat people use when results don't matter.

Hi Doc,

You did see that he ran the ball for 50 yards right?

And he only threw the ball 6 times in the first half, was that his fault or Dabolls?

Quote from: MightyGiants on November 04, 2024, 12:12:03 PMAccording to PFF, Daboll had elite QB play (QB rating and QBR tell a similar story) yesterday, and the team still looked bad.

Is that what you saw with your eyes yesterday? Elite qb play? Or did we scheme around a broken qb? I mean we had -5 yards throwing until almost halftime. Not sure I'd ever call 174 yards elite.

Yesterday the defense got abused by the 2nd best offense in the league.  They were definitely a problem.

The offense managed 16 points prior to garbage time against the 11th best defense in the league.  Also not good. 

It may be hard for some of us to accept because Washington has been awful for so long, but the Giants were outclassed in all phases yesterday and that includes coaching.

I think on the broadcast they said they have 7 new starters on defense this year. 

So with the right coaching and player acquisitions they did a rebuild in one offseason.  It starts with the QB but there are definitely other parts to it.

Their offense has scored on a pretty ridiculous % of their possessions (can't find the # at the moment but they scored on 14 consecutive at one point).

I've said it before and will say it again:  it's much easier to play defense when your offense is scoring more than 28 points/game.

Quote from: Jclayton92 on November 04, 2024, 12:19:58 PMIs that what you saw with your eyes yesterday? Elite qb play? Or did we scheme around a broken qb? I mean we had -5 yards throwing until almost halftime. Not sure I'd ever call 174 yards elite.

Didn't he have a TD throw and contribute with his legs?

Quote from: sxdxca38 on November 04, 2024, 12:19:04 PMHi Doc,

You did see that he ran the ball for 50 yards right?

And he only threw the ball 6 times in the first half, was that his fault or Dabolls?

Nearly half of those rushing yards occurred right before this idiotic fumble. This isn't fantasy football. This isn't tennis. You don't get credit for racking up yards and then turning the ball over because you're a moron and consistently make idiotic football plays.

https://x.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1853139688040575439?t=wNfn4mFwKX4cQ3eOg0J_eA&s=19

Quote from: Doc16LT56 on November 04, 2024, 12:30:12 PMNearly half of those rushing yards occurred right before this idiotic fumble. This isn't fantasy football. This isn't tennis. You don't get credit for racking up yards and then turning the ball over because you're a moron and consistently make idiotic football plays.

https://x.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1853139688040575439?t=wNfn4mFwKX4cQ3eOg0J_eA&s=19

Almost a pick six too. But of course these conveniently get omitted.

Jayden Daniels has a 128.8 RTG and 96 QBR, both higher than Jones.

In a 5 point game, maybe that was the difference?

Quote from: Doc16LT56 on November 04, 2024, 12:30:12 PMNearly half of those rushing yards occurred right before this idiotic fumble. This isn't fantasy football. This isn't tennis. You don't get credit for racking up yards and then turning the ball over because you're a moron and consistently make idiotic football plays.

https://x.com/NFL_DovKleiman/status/1853139688040575439?t=wNfn4mFwKX4cQ3eOg0J_eA&s=19

Quote from: MrGap92 on November 04, 2024, 12:33:44 PMAlmost a pick six too. But of course these conveniently get omitted.

Hi,

May I ask who allowed the defensive end a free pass right at the QB on his blind side?

Who completely whiffed at left tackle and didn't do his job?

May I ask why aren't you blaming him? Instead of Daniel Jones?

Quote from: sxdxca38 on November 04, 2024, 02:25:12 PMHi,

May I ask who allowed the defensive end a free pass right at the QB on his blind side?

Who completely whiffed at left tackle and didn't do his job?

May I ask why aren't you blaming him? Instead of Daniel Jones?

It's telling that no one even mentioned the blown block that caused the fumble