Big Blue Huddle

Quote from: londonblue on November 25, 2024, 06:30:50 AMI'd be unhappy if Nabers was happy. He was justified in his frustration. Now fix the drops if you want to be a leader longer term.

My draft rule of thumb to never take a WR high in the draft unless you have a QB holds not because of his personality but because this season has definitively shown no WR can save a team from bad QB play.

So never draft a skill player in the first round while picking early unless you have a PB QB? This is the chicken or the egg scenario! Nabors wasn't a luxury pick, he was a pick of desperate need based on how poor the 2023 WR squad was.

Quote from: TDToomer on November 25, 2024, 08:42:19 AMNo locker room cancers are made up by fans who are stuck in their ways and want quiet obedient servants with no personality. The media sticks a mic in Nabors face. What do you want him to say? "moving on to Thursday", "have to look a the tape". Basically the same old canned scripted responses.

I feel like I documented my position on this. 

Quote from: TDToomer on November 25, 2024, 08:45:39 AMSo never draft a skill player in the first round while picking early unless you have a PB QB? This is the chicken or the egg scenario! Nabors wasn't a luxury pick, he was a pick of desperate need based on how poor the 2023 WR squad was.

We know why they picked him. How did it work out? They still have no QB. They has a receiver who has talent but no one to throw to him and no prospects right now to change that. They are 2-9 with him and until they find that QB his talent will be wasted. They had opportunities to pick a QB, there were three who now are rated higher than any in this upcoming draft. They put themselves in a bad spot thinking Nabers would help Jones. Blind to what Jones was.

Quote from: coggs on November 25, 2024, 07:22:30 AMIn order for the veterans to "deal with" anything, they have to perform.  Anyone who is playing like $h!t, veteran or not, is not going to have any credibility.  This is not 2008 with some rookie talking after the team won the Super Bowl the year before.  If reports are accurate, the veterans probably agree with everything he is saying.

Not the point.

Quote from: londonblue on November 25, 2024, 06:30:50 AMI'd be unhappy if Nabers was happy. He was justified in his frustration. Now fix the drops if you want to be a leader longer term.

My draft rule of thumb to never take a WR high in the draft unless you have a QB holds not because of his personality but because this season has definitively shown no WR can save a team from bad QB play.

Let's get Daniel Jones some weapons!

Quote from: katkavage on November 25, 2024, 08:50:51 AMWe know why they picked him. How did it work out? They still have no QB. They has a receiver who has talent but no one to throw to him and no prospects right now to change that. They are 2-9 with him and until they find that QB his talent will be wasted. They had opportunities to pick a QB, there were three who now are rated higher than any in this upcoming draft. They put themselves in a bad spot thinking Nabers would help Jones. Blind to what Jones was.

I really feel they knew what they had in him. They needed to prove it to Mara.

Quote from: T200 on November 25, 2024, 08:48:29 AMI feel like I documented my position on this. 

Yup...

As a fan, I couldn't care less what goes on in the locker room, and the concept of "locker room cancer" is not my concern, it's an internal issue.

If Nabers is calling him "Dabs", it's probably because of how Daboll has the players address him. Not an issue.

The fact he's a rookie has no significance. This isn't the 1970s. He's a professional player and one of the most important ones on the team. One of the highest paid, too. He'll speak up if he has something to say. As such, he isn't wrong in what he is saying. The team sucks.

Wide receivers are known for their brash personalities. Conservative fans would maybe like them all to look and sound like Steve Largent or Wes Welker. Well, that's not the case with 99% of the guys who play the position, especially the stars.

The kid wants to win. He wants the ball. I'd rather have that than a guy who doesn't care and just collects his paycheck. He's upset after a bad loss, I don't blame him. Cut him some slack. 

Quote from: T200 on November 25, 2024, 09:02:08 AMI really feel they knew what they had in him. They needed to prove it to Mara.

Tim, I've always had the impression that Daboll and Schoen were tied at the hip and that Schoen wouldn't make a personal decision without Daboll being on board. Is it possible I'm wrong? Lately I'm getting the impression that Schoen's decisions and Mara's have put Daboll between a rock and a hard place.

Daboll right up until the end publicly supported Jones. But he had to see that the man was never going to cut it. Is it a safe bet to say that Daboll wanted a QB and Schoen bypassed Nix and JJ because of Mara? Was the Tommy decision which soured the locker room Mara influenced?

Quote from: BlueMoshik on November 25, 2024, 09:17:00 AMAs a fan, I couldn't care less what goes on in the locker room, and the concept of "locker room cancer" is not my concern, it's an internal issue.

If Nabers is calling him "Dabs", it's probably because of how Daboll has the players address him. Not an issue.

The fact he's a rookie has no significance. This isn't the 1970s. He's a professional player and one of the most important ones on the team. One of the highest paid, too. He'll speak up if he has something to say. As such, he isn't wrong in what he is saying. The team sucks.

Wide receivers are known for their brash personalities. Conservative fans would maybe like them all to look and sound like Steve Largent or Wes Welker. Well, that's not the case with 99% of the guys who play the position, especially the stars.

The kid wants to win. He wants the ball. I'd rather have that than a guy who doesn't care and just collects his paycheck. He's upset after a bad loss, I don't blame him. Cut him some slack. 

  THIS 100%

Quote from: Ed Vette on November 25, 2024, 09:17:07 AMTim, I've always had the impression that Daboll and Schoen were tied at the hip and that Schoen wouldn't make a personal decision without Daboll being on board. Is it possible I'm wrong? Lately I'm getting the impression that Schoen's decisions and Mara's have put Daboll between a rock and a hard place.

Daboll right up until the end publicly supported Jones. But he had to see that the man was never going to cut it. Is it a safe bet to say that Daboll wanted a QB and Schoen bypassed Nix and JJ because of Mara? Was the Tommy decision which soured the locker room Mara influenced?

Ed,

I see it a little differently. I agree that Schoen and Daboll came in as a tandem and that hasn't changed. Offensively, I think Daboll let Schoen know what players, by name, that he wants. Daboll wasn't keen on JJ, Nix, or Penix.

I don't think they expected 2022 to go the way it did with a vanilla offense. I think the plan was to dumb down the offensive scheme, show Mara that even with a basic offense, Jones couldn't run it successfully, then they could move on from him. Best laid plans, right?

So now Daboll had to pivot. Add more pro-level plays to the offense and see how Jones does. He didn't do well and then the injuries. He felt the pressure and heat and decided that if he was going to get canned for this guy, he's going to do all he can and took over the OC hat from Kafka. Can't say I blame him but now he has no one else to blame.

As I mentioned in another thread, I don't think Schoen fires him. It will be up to Mara. I'd be curious to see, in a weird twist of deja vu, if Schoen pulls a Wink card and leaves because Mara fires his friend.

Quote from: T200 on November 25, 2024, 09:27:09 AMEd,

I see it a little differently. I agree that Schoen and Daboll came in as a tandem and that hasn't changed. Offensively, I think Daboll let Schoen know what players, by name, that he wants. Daboll wasn't keen on JJ, Nix, or Penix.

I don't think they expected 2022 to go the way it did with a vanilla offense. I think the plan was to dumb down the offensive scheme, show Mara that even with a basic offense, Jones couldn't run it successfully, then they could move on from him. Best laid plans, right?

So now Daboll had to pivot. Add more pro-level plays to the offense and see how Jones does. He didn't do well and then the injuries. He felt the pressure and heat and decided that if he was going to get canned for this guy, he's going to do all he can and took over the OC hat from Kafka. Can't say I blame him but now he has no one else to blame.

As I mentioned in another thread, I don't think Schoen fires him. It will be up to Mara. I'd be curious to see, in a weird twist of deja vu, if Schoen pulls a Wink card and leaves because Mara fires his friend.

That last sentence... interesting

If it comes down to Nabers or Daboll, we'll have a new coach next year. Nabers clearly doesn't respect Daboll and his status as the #1 rookie carries weight in the locker room. There doesn't appear to be a veteran presence to check him.

As much as I want to have Daboll back, I'm not sure he survives this.

In all fairness, I am not sure how you can be angry that the guy you drafted ends up being exactly the guy you thought you were drafting.

Quote from: T200 on November 25, 2024, 09:27:09 AMEd,

I see it a little differently. I agree that Schoen and Daboll came in as a tandem and that hasn't changed. Offensively, I think Daboll let Schoen know what players, by name, that he wants. Daboll wasn't keen on JJ, Nix, or Penix.

I don't think they expected 2022 to go the way it did with a vanilla offense. I think the plan was to dumb down the offensive scheme, show Mara that even with a basic offense, Jones couldn't run it successfully, then they could move on from him. Best laid plans, right?

So now Daboll had to pivot. Add more pro-level plays to the offense and see how Jones does. He didn't do well and then the injuries. He felt the pressure and heat and decided that if he was going to get canned for this guy, he's going to do all he can and took over the OC hat from Kafka. Can't say I blame him but now he has no one else to blame.

As I mentioned in another thread, I don't think Schoen fires him. It will be up to Mara. I'd be curious to see, in a weird twist of deja vu, if Schoen pulls a Wink card and leaves because Mara fires his friend.

His friend? Schoen will be lucky if he keeps his job. GM openings don't come up every day. I don't think he'll give up his position because Daboll is gone.

Also, a GM hasn't fired anyone on this team since the George Young era. It will be Mara firing Daboll, and that's a big part of the problem. Mara doesn't have an idea who would make a good HC and who would be terrible. This is the man who hired Joe Judge for heaven's sake. This is why every 2-3 years we find ourselves in exactly the same situation.