Big Blue Huddle

I find it interesting to see where the beat writers and pundits covering the team are landing on the keep or move on from Schoen and/or Daboll debate.  So far, this is how I see them coming out.


Actively campaigning to keep Schoen and Daboll.

Art Stapleton
Patti Traina
Ed Valentine

Actively pushing to clean house.

Pat Leonard
Jordon Ranaan
Ryan Dunlevy
Connor Hughes

Staying on the sidelines (mixed signals)

Carl Banks
Paul Schwartz
Giants Insider Chris Bisignano
Ralph Vacchiano

No surprise that Leonard and Raanan are in the "out" camp (and I like Pat) but they are very antagonist.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on December 01, 2024, 09:17:05 AMNo surprise that Leonard and Raanan are in the "out" camp (and I like Pat) but they are very antagonist.

I suspect that it's because those two haven't been on the Giants' beat as long.  They both have only covered the Giants as a bad team (for years)

Quote from: MightyGiants on December 01, 2024, 09:34:11 AMI suspect that it's because those two haven't been on the Giants' beat as long.  They both have only covered the Giants as a bad team (for years)

I don't read much of Raanan but I do follow Leonard's work. I find him very much to be a click baiting master. Which is fine, it's his job.

That's not to say he doesn't have a point but I think it's over egged for engagement.

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on December 01, 2024, 09:38:27 AMI don't read much of Raanan but I do follow Leonard's work. I find him very much to be a click baiting master. Which is fine, it's his job.

That's not to say he doesn't have a point but I think it's over egged for engagement.

I don't read much of their work, but I do listen to both men's podcasts.  I like podcasts better as they tend to be less formal, and I think you get a better sense of the person than you do through their formal written work.  In point of fact, at one time or other, I have listened to the podcasts of pretty much everyone on the list (with the exception of Connor Hughes)

Quote from: EDjohnst1981 on December 01, 2024, 09:38:27 AMI don't read much of Raanan but I do follow Leonard's work. I find him very much to be a click baiting master. Which is fine, it's his job.

That's not to say he doesn't have a point but I think it's over egged for engagement.

On the other hand, those in the Schoen and Daboll camp may be hoping for preferential treatment should they retain their jobs.  I have heard enough stories from beat writers to know that coaches and GMs monitor what they write and will treat a reporter better or worse based on what they see.

What about Dan Duggan Rich? He's a fairly prominent voice in this group, and I tend to respect the Athletic overall.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on December 01, 2024, 10:01:04 AMWhat about Dan Duggan Rich? He's a fairly prominent voice in this group, and I tend to respect the Athletic overall.

I would put him in the staying-neutral camp

I believe this hasn't been decided, yet ,.. with 5 games to go. Truly think Mara probably wants stability but empty seats the final 2 home games (and if it snows before one) won't help.

I'm done with them, though. Combined botch job from the start..just roster management alone has cost the Giants games. Plus,the poor fundamentals, bad 2 drafts, Jones' contract, half-time adjustments .or lack there of..etc. etc.

Daboll never elevated Jones, as was the hope, his management style both has created friction and let stuff slide at the same time. And Schoen has shown
(pun intended) to be a very pedestrian
GM...if that.

I'm done. Start over..new regime..let them pick the qb..fix the roster. 

 

Quote from: spiderblue43 on December 01, 2024, 10:16:58 AMI believe this hasn't been decided, yet ,.. with 5 games to go. Truly think Mara probably wants stability but empty seats the final 2 home games (and if it snows before one) won't help.

I'm done with them, though. Combined botch job from the start..just roster management alone has cost the Giants games. Plus,the poor fundamentals, bad 2 drafts, Jones' contract, half-time adjustments .or lack there of..etc. etc.

Daboll never elevated Jones, as was the hope, his management style both has created friction and let stuff slide at the same time. And Schoen has shown
(pun intended) to be a very pedestrian
GM...if that.

I'm done. Start over..new regime..let them pick the qb..fix the roster. 

 

I think you're correct about Mara having not decided.  There are three in the neutral camp who would be in one of the other camps (supporting Mara's decision) Banks, Schwartz, and Chris B.

It will be hard to retain a head coach if he finishes the season with 2 wins and/or even three. But I can see Mara keeping Schoen and having him show his cojones by firing his buddy he brought along with him (the first mistake made almost four years ago). If Mara had no nonsense CEO traits, he would never keep either. No smart CEO would. But he is a softie which is nice and cute, but doesn't win you much in football or in other businesses. Steinbrenner was impetuous and took the approach to the extreme and it ultimately hurt the Yankees. But I do remember the blowback (from me included) when he fired Buck Showalter after a winning playoff season and hiring "Clueless" Joe Torre. The rest is history.

Quote from: DaveBrown74 on December 01, 2024, 10:01:04 AMWhat about Dan Duggan Rich? He's a fairly prominent voice in this group, and I tend to respect the Athletic overall.

I listened to Duggan being interviewed on the Talkin Giants podcast.   As of this week, Dan is clearly in the fire Schoen and Daboll Camp

Quote from: katkavage on December 01, 2024, 10:58:58 AMIt will be hard to retain a head coach if he finishes the season with 2 wins and/or even three. But I can see Mara keeping Schoen and having him show his cojones by firing his buddy he brought along with him (the first mistake made almost four years ago). If Mara had no nonsense CEO traits, he would never keep either. No smart CEO would. But he is a softie which is nice and cute, but doesn't win you much in football or in other businesses. Steinbrenner was impetuous and took the approach to the extreme and it ultimately hurt the Yankees. But I do remember the blowback (from me included) when he fired Buck Showalter after a winning playoff season and hiring "Clueless" Joe Torre. The rest is history.

It shouldn't be up to Mara. Either he's going to allow Schoen to make the decision or he's going to usurp his authority. 

If he doesn't trust that Schoen is going to make the best decisions for the team, then that's who he needs to fire, and everyone under him. Clean house from top to bottom.

Quote from: T200 on December 14, 2024, 11:07:56 AMIt shouldn't be up to Mara. Either he's going to allow Schoen to make the decision or he's going to usurp his authority. 

If he doesn't trust that Schoen is going to make the best decisions for the team, then that's who he needs to fire, and everyone under him. Clean house from top to bottom.

That is what he most definitely should do, but that's against Mara's history. And we fans continue to suffer from his decisions.

Quote from: katkavage on December 14, 2024, 11:51:28 AMThat is what he most definitely should do, but that's against Mara's history. And we fans continue to suffer from his decisions.

There's no evidence that he doesn't trust Schoen. Even though things don't appear to be going in the right direction, I think 3 years is too quick to fire a new GM.

He had a lot to clean up between the roster and cap. Yes, it's a legit argument that after three years that the roster isn't much better than what he inherited.

As I have been saying, the QB is the biggest roster blemish that he inherited. I'm OK with letting them pick their QB and seeing how the team, mostly the offense, performs. If there is significant improvement (mostly in on-field performance), great. If not, they can kick rocks.